"Proud Formula Feeder"?

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-23-2004
"Proud Formula Feeder"?
1054
Thu, 12-14-2006 - 8:27pm

In my playgroup, I've noticed some members have a blinkie I haven't seen before: "Proud Formula Feeder". In the past, I've seen the "Formula Feeding Mom" and "It's formula, not rat poison", but this new one struck me as odd. I can understand simply stating that you formula feed or saying that formula isn't rat poison (because it isn't), but I've been trying to figure out just why someone would be "proud" to FF.

While I don't think that women should necessarily feel guilty about not BF, I don't get what about FF there is to be proud about. Most (or maybe even all) of the women with said blinkie acknowledge that breastmilk is better, so why would they be proud to feed their babies something they know is substandard, even if they couldn't BF and FF was their only choice? What do you ladies think? Is/should there be such a thing as FF pride?

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iVillage Member
Registered: 12-12-2006
Mon, 01-08-2007 - 1:12pm

"Anyhow. I just don't think you need to ONLY look at 3rd world countries' BF rates. There are other places with good rates too. Now we need to find out what makes those rates go up. Is it a lack of prudishness coupled with the longer mat. leaves? Or is it something entirely different? Whatever it is, if we can implement it in N. America, then rates should gradually go up to more "ideal" levels."

Sure, when we are discussing bfing rates. I think my post was in response to the appropriateness of the whole "starving women in 3rd world countries make milk, so even if you have a bad diet you can still make good milk" thing. I still don't see why we need to go there when simple facts about bfing in general would work just fine.

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iVillage Member
Registered: 12-12-2006
Mon, 01-08-2007 - 1:26pm

"I feel that childbirth and BFing ARE somewhat different. If your birth is way too painful for you to handle, you can't get around it except with meds. If you can't easily Bf or don't want to, there is pumping or at least in some people's cases, mother-to-mother donation of BM. Formula is NOT the "first possible other alternative" at least not in most mothers' cases."

Why should drugs automatically be the "first possible other alternative"? What about relaxation techniques, breathing exercises, massage, hypnobirthing, or water births - all of which help women handle the pain drug free. I was just pointing out that nature sets as *standard* an unmedicated, vaginal birth - it is not some mythical holy grail situation - same as bfing. There are alternatives for those who find it impossible, but when the rates for use of epidurals is somewhere around 75% and c-section rates are somewhere around 25% it would seem there is a *huge* double standard out there. It's ok to take risks with you baby during childbirth, but not when it comes to feeding that child. I have a hard time believing that 75% of the population "can't take the pain", especially considering women had *no choice* in the matter for a long time. Funny same as women here seem to have a hard time believing so many women "can't" bf for whatever reason. I really don't think it's so different. I just think our attitudes about childbirth have finally settled on a middle ground (for a long time pretty much *all* women were put under to have their babies, then in the baby boom gen the battle cry was 'natural childbirth for all' and women were put down if they chose pain relief or needed a c-section). The attitudes haven't quite reached that middle ground here when it comes to bfing. BTW - I think it's perfectly acceptable to use pain relief during childbirth, but I do think it is overused and we should be very careful in making that decision.

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iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Mon, 01-08-2007 - 1:38pm

OK touché. I should have thought to mention other pain control techniques...and believe you me, I am a big supporter of them: my 2 births were natural, though in the first bathing in the warm water felt very good and helped control the pain.

I DO have a problem with the high c-section rates and epi. rates nowadays...I think they are pushed too much on unsuspecting mothers by doctors who want to get out of there in time for their golf game, to a certain extent (obviously not ALL doctors are like this, but it seems to happen a LOT these days). C-section rates are very very low in some places and it would seem it is entirely possible to limit them to under 10%, except so many doctors don't want to.

Fio

Avatar for mrsmichael6300
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
Mon, 01-08-2007 - 2:34pm

>>Why should drugs automatically be the "first possible other alternative"? What about relaxation techniques, breathing exercises, massage, hypnobirthing, or water births - all of which help women handle the pain drug free. I was just pointing out that nature sets as *standard* an unmedicated, vaginal birth - it is not some mythical holy grail situation - same as bfing. There are alternatives for those who find it impossible, but when the rates for use of epidurals is somewhere around 75% and c-section rates are somewhere around 25% it would seem there is a *huge* double standard out there. It's ok to take risks with you baby during childbirth, but not when it comes to feeding that child. I have a hard time believing that 75% of the population "can't take the pain", especially considering women had *no choice* in the matter for a long time. Funny same as women here seem to have a hard time believing so many women "can't" bf for whatever reason.<<

Exactly. The epidural rate is closer to 90% in a lot of hospitals, and c-sections are at around 33%, some areas as high as 50%, now! Current research shows that ERCS (elective repeat c-section) carries a three-fold higher risk of death to the mother and infant, and that carries over to first-time mothers choosing an elective c-section, as well.

And FWIW, I don't think it's "ok" to take risks during labor and birth, either, and one of my pet peeves is the lack of information healthcare professionals provide in regards to the possible risks/side effects of pain meds and anesthesia during labor. It really burns me up to have to hear some poor mom say, "If only they had told me that an epidural could result in XYZ, I wouldn't have done it," or, "If I had known that first time moms are an average of 8 days overdue and that induction increases risk of c-section by 50%, I wouldn't have had an induction!" For some reason, OB's believe that by not painting the entire picture they are "helping" women escape the impossible pain of birth, or making it more convenient through induction and scheduled Cesarean (and let's face it, more convenient to OB's, which is evident in the fact that the majority of births in the US now occur Monday through Friday between teh hours of 9 AM and 5 PM). It's never made any sense to me htat if you sign a consent form for an epidural for surgery, it lists everything and anything, but if you sign it for labor and birth, it's truncated. Why??? It's perfectly fine for a mother to opt for chemical pain relief, but it's not ok to take away her right to informed consent. That's unethical...




Edited 1/8/2007 2:37 pm ET by mrsmichael6300
iVillage Member
Registered: 02-21-2006
Mon, 01-08-2007 - 3:13pm

I know you didn't ask for my opinion on this, but I do believe women can give birth without using drugs, but just like formula use, they've been conditioned by society to believe that it's too hard.

My birth experiences were: 1 with stadol in IV (hated it), 2 unmedicated, 1 with epidural, 1 unmedicated at home. Yeah, my unmedicated births were "harder" than the medicated ones, but they were also a whole lot more enjoyable.

There are times when an epidural can help, provided you're in a hospital. If you're more inclined to go the unmedicated route and you need relief, you're more likely to use breathing exercises, hypnobirthing, massage, etc.

It all comes down to the attitudes that we have that are shaped by what society tells us. Society says that formula is perfectly fine, so women have no reason to deal with the difficulties that can be present in breastfeeding. Society also says that having pain relief is perfectly fine -- and why should you be in pain if you don't have to? -- so women have little incentive to seek out alternatives to medication and the high epidural use contributes to the high c-section rate.

RPS

 

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iVillage Member
Registered: 11-06-2003
Mon, 01-08-2007 - 4:08pm

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I totally agree with what you've said. I had an induction with DD and an epidural. Both were planned. I didn't even consider NOT having an epidural. The induction was completely unnecessary, but my doctor brought it up and I thought she knew best (and, of course, she does know her stuff, but in my case an induction was NOT necessary). The epidural was a given as far as I was concerned.

It was only just recently that I learned there were indeed risks to both interventions. While my daughter's birth was pretty smooth, I will not chose an induction again. And I will plan on an unmedicated birth as well.

iVillage Member
Registered: 12-12-2006
Mon, 01-08-2007 - 4:16pm
I didn't realize it was that high in some areas. That's shocking to me. So I reiterate, why is it that we are so quick to tell women the risks of ffing, but we leave the whole childbirth pain med thing alone? Especially since using pain meds during childbirth can result in a rather sleepy newborn, or even one who requires observation in the hospital, making bfing even more difficult. It's a snowball effect, and it's sad.
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iVillage Member
Registered: 12-12-2006
Mon, 01-08-2007 - 4:19pm
Your post brings me to a whole new twist (as if there haven't been enough here already, lol). If 'society conditions us' is it our fault? Are women who ff to blame for their decision, or are they victims of a society that values comfort and convenience? Just a thought....
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iVillage Member
Registered: 01-07-2005
Mon, 01-08-2007 - 4:19pm

>>>It was only just recently that I learned there were indeed risks to both interventions. While my daughter's birth was pretty smooth, I will not chose an induction again. And I will plan on an unmedicated birth as well.>>>

And this is where I have to say that I think it is amazing if you can go unmedicated. I tried for two hours and went from 3-5 cms. I was told I had five more hours of this which is incrediable fast. I was induced however it was because I never went into natural labour! I opted for an epidural when I just could not take it (I then gave birth in 45 minutes after going from 5-10 in half an hour). It was not pleasant unmedicated and I was walking around within a halof hour. I could not take it! I tried but it is not for me. I do not rate that with formula feeding. Some do however, I do not agree...

Spud...







Lilypie




iVillage Member
Registered: 12-12-2006
Mon, 01-08-2007 - 4:26pm

"And this is where I have to say that I think it is amazing if you can go unmedicated. I tried for two hours and went from 3-5 cms. I was told I had five more hours of this which is incrediable fast. I was induced however it was because I never went into natural labour! I opted for an epidural when I just could not take it (I then gave birth in 45 minutes after going from 5-10 in half an hour). It was not pleasant unmedicated and I was walking around within a halof hour. I could not take it! I tried but it is not for me. I do not rate that with formula feeding. Some do however, I do not agree..."

I know you weren't adressing me, but I brought it up so I'll reply. We know there are risks to pain relief during childbirth just as we know there are risks to ffing. Why is one set of risks acceptable but the other is not? Why is the mother's comfort such a huge concern on the one hand and not on the other? I don't understand why we think it's perfectly ok for the vast majority of women to take risks during childbirth, but when it comes to feeding methods we think no one should unless *absolutely, positively* necessary. Why is bfing "standard" but unmedicated, vaginal births are seen as "too difficult" for most?

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