Who said "Formula is evil"?

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-14-2003
Who said "Formula is evil"?
824
Mon, 11-03-2008 - 12:14pm

Ok, we need to get back to debating - so I typed "formula is evil" into Google & found most were saying,



~*~ Catherine, mom to three grown men - Jason, Michael & Joshua and Granma to Christopher & Leia.


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iVillage Member
Registered: 12-19-2006
Tue, 12-02-2008 - 5:05pm

>>>>


I THOUGHT I smelled a set-up!!!


I'm shocked, SHOCKED, I tell you, that you fell for that magpiemamma!


The correct response was "more ffed babies would have improperly sealed guts than bfed babies" because breast milk is the standard, not a magic elixir!


>>>>


A set-up???? No, it wasn't, I wanted to be clear. I expected her to say "more ffed babies ....." but she felt confident it was all.

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Lee

Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie!'... till you can find a rock.

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-14-2007
Tue, 12-02-2008 - 5:06pm

I think for Lee or anyone, it would seem odd when it's new, unfamiliar, not part of your culture, etc. Her point that she's been drinking cows milk for over 30 years was that it's known, familiar, expected, part of her culture and such. New/different is always more likely to seem odd/unusual. IMHO.>>>>>

Maybe. I mean, I grew up drinking cow milk too and it wasn't until I was pregnant about this time last year that I started really learning more about this. But donor milk never struck me as odd. I'm also fairly open minded to new ideas though and tend to not cling to my norms as staunchly as I've seen others do. I'm no better or worse for it, but I suppose I made the mistake of projecting my acceptance onto Lee.

<<>>

Not knowing much about M2M beyond my experience, I'll try to answer what I can. I odn't know what the demand is, or how much milk is available. How does it work? Where I donate, you put your ad up basically and mums contact you. You have a conversation about medication/diet/shipping costs, etc. You choose a mom or two or what have you and you ship the milk. I realize it seems likea lot of work and this is the case where you have to really feel breastmilk is important enough. It's easy to make something sound hard before you try it. It's easy to talk yourself out of something before oyu try it. People tell me all the time they think cloth diapering takes a lot of work but I've been doing it for almost a year and it's nothing to me. Just part of the routine. Do you see what I mean?

<<>>

I am also interested. Based in my limited experience, I think most moms who pump milk and have extra are willing to donate what they can. At least, as far as I have seen.




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iVillage Member
Registered: 10-14-2007
Tue, 12-02-2008 - 5:10pm

I wasn't arguing you think of it as evil. I was arguing that it can come out sounding evil, depending on how you go about making the argument. I don't think it's evil. But I can see how some might perceive that others on this board, or others out in the bf'ing community believe it to be evil, by the way they describe it's horrible and harmful effects.>>>

Ok - but that would be THEIR own subjective opinion, you know what I mean? Someone can tell me all the risks about cosleeping and I can choose to think about it critically or I can respond emotionally. If I were the sort to respond emotionally to things, I probably would think they were cosleeping bullies. If I chose to use critical thinking instead, I could sort out the information as just that, information. Being the type to usually think things through to death, I'd tend to not be offended by something someone else was. I can't honestly help it if someone thinks I make formula sound evil. The truth is, I just say what it is. If they see it as evil, that is a projection on their part. I don't understand what I am supposed to do? Sugar coat it? That just gives them reason to feel like it's not that bad. Do you see the dilemma?




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iVillage Member
Registered: 10-14-2007
Tue, 12-02-2008 - 5:12pm

Why debate?

"He learns to use a library, and to find the exact information he needs in the shortest possible time. He learns to be thorough and accurate. He learns to analyze; to distinguish between the vital and the unimportant. He learns the need of proving his statements; of supporting every statement with valid evidence and sound reasoning—and he learns to demand the same sort of proof for the statements of others. He learns to present ideas in a clear and effective manner, and in a way which wins others to his way of thinking. He learns to think under pressure, to "use his head" in a time of need, to make decisions quickly and accurately. In a word, the essential point in any debating situation is that of convincing the listener that your side of the proposition is desirable." (from How to Debate by Harrison Boyd Summers)..

http://www.triviumpursuit.com/speech_debate/what_is_debate.htm




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iVillage Member
Registered: 10-14-2007
Tue, 12-02-2008 - 5:19pm

The ignorance is unfortunate in such a developed country.>>

Actually, it makes a lot of sense. Development leads to rise of industry which leads to profit which leads to greed which leads to measures taken to ensure continued profit which leads to cover ups, twisted information and the perpetuation of myth which compounds itself into the common culture who aren't really thinking critically FTMP because we're just going about our days trying to do the best with what we have, making ends meet while the greedy tycoons continue on with the above pattern.

But I agree, it is unfortunate.




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iVillage Member
Registered: 10-14-2007
Tue, 12-02-2008 - 5:24pm

A variety of folks that are pro-bf? Is anyone here pro-FF? I know there are people who did FF, either they had to or were uninformed at the time or tried but couldn't make it work but will try next time. But is there really a balance here? How can there be a balance when there is only one right answer?>>>

Exactly. The science and mother nature are both on the BF side. It's awfully hard to debate against breastmilk in most cases. But we can't help that. FF are welcome here, but what do they really have to debate?




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iVillage Member
Registered: 10-14-2007
Tue, 12-02-2008 - 5:31pm

Well I think character was brought into it somewhat when Lee was accused of only considering feelings when making decisions and being in deep denial, or whatever the phrase was.>>>

No no no. Do not quote me out of context. My statement was not calling Lee's character into question in the least bit. Her rationale on one issue, yeah? But her character? Hardly. I take care not to border on personal attack, ever. I don't appreciate being taken out of context. Perhaps you didn't fully understand my original statement, but please don't go around saying I'm accusing Lee of having a character flaw. You are taking my statement, which was applied to only one part of a person's arguement, and applying it across the board. That is just as unfair as using extreme examples to make points. Please don't.




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iVillage Member
Registered: 10-14-2007
Tue, 12-02-2008 - 5:35pm

The person who was trying to prove that I don't know what a true debate is, has yet to back that up.>>>

haha...I wasn't trying to prove anything. I laid out a definition for you. I never accused you of not knowing either. And I'm sorry it took me two days to get back here. I am a full time student who works a part time job and is raising a ten month old, mostly by myself. I'm busy.




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iVillage Member
Registered: 06-24-2008
Tue, 12-02-2008 - 5:36pm
Ok I said she has bf'd so whooever posted info would post it about bf'ing and ff'ing, one then the other or both at the same time, and also my sitch of a dose or two of formula then exclusive bf'ing. Just to get accurate info.
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"The key to good decision making is not knowledge. It is understanding."
Malcolm Gladwell Blink

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-14-2007
Tue, 12-02-2008 - 5:39pm

It can be the truth, and still sound evil.>>>

You know what though? I can't possibly carry a barometer with me to understand which words I should use in which situations with which people. To me, saying "I want to kill Jewish people" sounds evil. Saying "Formula raises the risk of ear infections by 300%" does not. I mean, perspective varies.




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