Most Americans believe...

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-11-2006
Most Americans believe...
91
Tue, 10-18-2011 - 8:37am

Do you think this is true? Do most Americans believe in these things? Do you? Which ones?

A large majority of the American people consistently support the following agenda:

  • Tax the rich and corporations
  • End the wars, bring the troops home, cut military spending
  • Protect the social safety net, strengthen Social Security and improved Medicare for all
  • End corporate welfare for oil companies and other big business interests
  • Transition to a clean energy economy, reverse environmental degradation
  • Protect worker rights including collective bargaining, create jobs and raise wages
  • Get money out of politics

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iVillage Member
Registered: 03-02-2009
Sun, 10-30-2011 - 11:23pm
nisupulla wrote:

I do not think that "living wage" and "being paid more than the job is worth" are interchangeable terms.

Then why call for a living wage if it is not greater than the market value of the job? We have an efficient market, so, overall, jobs are being compensated at market value.

Do you think that a jack-hammer operator does not work as hard as major league baseball player? The ball player makes tens of millions of dollars per year, more than scores of jack-hammer operators. Why is that? It's all about market value.

So why should an employer pay more than a job is worth? Do you know anyone that goes to a car dealer and offers to pay more money than they are asking for the car?

GM foolishly paid more to autoworkers than the job was worth, as evidenced by other manufacturers getting their cars built for a much lower wage. The market doesn't care what the intentions are, the consequence is severe, which GM found out.

"Resist, we much. We must, and we much. About that, be committed."

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-03-2009
Sun, 10-30-2011 - 11:24pm
Yeah, it's so outrageous to "demand" a living wage and safe working conditions.

Corporations who send jobs overseas to sweat shop countries do so because that's how they can produce cheaper goods and make bigger profit margins.

We have, to a large extent, committed the same sin as Esau in the Old Testament. He sold his birthright as first born for a bowl of pottage. We have sold our jobs overseas and are now faced with massive trade deficits, primarily to China.

Ironic as hell that a communist country has three trillion dollars in foreign currency funds which it's looking to invest. Global capitalism is proving to be the undoing of our once-prosperous nation but we aided and abetted the process by demanding lots of cheap (both in price and quality) consumer goods.

Jabberwocka

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-11-2006
Mon, 10-31-2011 - 7:33am

Then why call for a living wage if it is not greater than the market value of the job?

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-11-2006
Mon, 10-31-2011 - 7:39am

We have an efficient market, so, overall, jobs are being compensated at market value.

That makes no sense. Could you maybe explain how you have arrived at this conclusion.

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-11-2006
Mon, 10-31-2011 - 8:00am

Yeah, it's so outrageous to "demand" a living wage and safe working conditions.

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-11-2006
Mon, 10-31-2011 - 8:21am

A short quote from the article:

The Triangle Shirtwaist Factory Fire: The Legal Legacy p.14

The families, most of them poverty stricken, were overwhelmed by the necessities of earning a living and could not afford the cost of litigation.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-03-2009
Mon, 10-31-2011 - 8:32am

My DH started his own company twenty years ago. He's seen how drastically the costs of health care insurance premiums have risen in that time frame.

I think it's important to have some awareness of how and why companies came to offer insurance coverage to employees. During at least one period, that coverage was an incentive to draw qualified personnel. http://eh.net/encyclopedia/article/thomasson.insurance.health.us

If I had my 'druthers, health care providers would be more numerous, multiple provider and treatment options would be available and insurance would be taken largely out of the health care equation. Why? There haven't been the sort of competitive pressures which would reduce costs. Instead, there's been a fair degree of price- and supply-fixing while demand has skyrocketed. It's time we expected better from what has been a badly flawed system.

Both employers and unions have been guilty of extreme behavior. Rather than working towards common goals and common good, they have been adversarial. "Good" managers know that their employees have the potential to be a valuable resource. "Good" employees know that if they work hard, the company will prosper and they will receive promotions.

But the whole concept of "what the job is worth" is largely subjective. Who makes the call? What's motivating the thought process? And in an employment market like the one we currently have, what mechanism is in place to avoid exploiting desperate people who badly need jobs?

Jabberwocka

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-11-2006
Mon, 10-31-2011 - 10:10am

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-02-2009
Tue, 11-01-2011 - 11:42pm
nisupulla wrote:

We have an efficient market, so, overall, jobs are being compensated at market value.

That makes no sense. Could you maybe explain how you have arrived at this conclusion.

"Resist, we much. We must, and we much. About that, be committed."

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-30-2011
Mon, 11-14-2011 - 1:48pm

It is beyond me how someone could be aware of the events that led to the tragedy and then go on to believe that employers willingly pay their employees what the job is worth.

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