Bill would let clergy refuse to marry ga

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-30-2003
Bill would let clergy refuse to marry ga
9
Tue, 02-02-2010 - 1:33pm

Clearly this is just a waste of time and money, but if actually spelling out this freedom that already exists convinces people to change their minds, I suppose it will be worth it. I have my doubts though, because this always struck me as a disingenuous argument, rather than a legitimate concern.

http://www.sfchronicle.us/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2010/01/27/BAL11BO179.DTL&type=gaylesbian

Anne

I have no need for anger
With intimate strangers
And I got nothing to hide


- Amy Ray

I have no need for anger
With intimate strangers
And I got nothing to hide


- Amy Ray

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-09-2001
Tue, 02-02-2010 - 2:58pm
Well, given this is one of the big excuses often touted by those against gay marriage becoming legal, it would show them up for their lies on this angle. Even if Canada is a reality based example that demonstrates that no churches are being forced to do any marrying they don't want to do. But, with minds slammed shut and determined to deny civil rights and hide behind so-called twisted "religious freedom," always the same game plan, I doubt it would really make any difference at all. <:-\\


Blessings,

Gypsy

)O(



Photobucket



Strong like a mountain,

Flowing like a river."

~~Tai Chi Chih



Photobucket





Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket Photobucket



Mika Dog




"All things share the same breath;

the beast, the tree, the man.

The Air shares its spirit with

all the life it supports."

--Chief Seattle



"If there are no dogs in Heaven,

then when I die I want to go where they went."

~Will Rogers



"The greatness of a nation and its moral progress

can be judged by the way its animals are treated."

~~Mahatma Gandhi





Photobucket Photobucket






Blessings,

Gypsy

)O(



iVillage Member
Registered: 04-18-2006
Wed, 02-03-2010 - 10:57am
You no idea how many LDS friends I have that tried that angle with me. Then had I to painstakingly explain how that couldn't work and then still didn't get it until I brought up the fact that if someone could sue that a clergyman refused to marry someone for religious reasons that women could sue for the priesthood.
Photobucket
My Two Monsters!

"Reality has a well known liberal bias" - Stephan Colbert

O Lord Lead me from the unreal to the real.
Lead me from the darkness to light.
Lead me from death to immortality.
May there be peace, peace, and perfect peace.
Brihadaranyaka Upanishads (1.3.28)
Photobucket
iVillage Member
Registered: 11-20-2008
Fri, 02-05-2010 - 12:16am

I think anyone who puts forth that argument is willfully lieing. No fault divorce did NOT force the Catholic church to marry divorced people. In fact, churches are NOT required to marry anyone, they may choose to only members of their religion, and and they can pick and choose who they will marry based on any criteria, allowing gays the right to legally will NOT force churches to recognize or perform their marriages.

Also, the whole adding gays to the hate crimes protection will make illegal for preachers to preach against homosexuality is another willful lie. Homophobes love to falseley assert that our country is on the brink of jailing people for speaking out AGAINST homosexuality, but how many of them are aghast at the fact that in Uganda, there is a law being proposed that would not only give the death penalty for "aggravated homosexuality" but would also make it a crime for anyone to speak out in favor of homosexuality. And how many of the homophobes are talking about the fact that this draconian legislation had some help from "conservatives' in America ?

iVillage Member
Registered: 02-18-2006
Fri, 02-05-2010 - 9:24am
Or how many of them know that the police stand guard and protect the KKK as they have peaceful demonstrations and speeches about white supremacy on the steps of town halls in my state, LAST YEAR, because it is still legal for them to say despicable and ignorant things, even though all races are protected by the hate crimes bill?



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"I am a wizard, not a saint." - Harry Dresden





~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"'Cause love's such an old-fashioned word, and love dares you to care for the people on th
iVillage Member
Registered: 02-18-2006
Fri, 02-05-2010 - 9:25am
(Actually, I will have to see if I can find the newspaper photo - the KKK is up on the steps in white robes, demonstrating, and there is a policeman, in full riot gear, standing guard with a grim look - and he is black.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"'Cause love's such an old-fashioned word, and love dares you to care for the people on th
iVillage Member
Registered: 11-20-2008
Sat, 02-06-2010 - 11:33am

That officer certainly exemplifies the spirit of "I disagree with what you say, but I'll defend your right to say it" (or some such quote, I am paraphrasing as I do not know the exact quote)

Meanwhile, a few noisy Christian Nationalists are boo-hooing that protecting gays from hate crimes, or allowing gays to marry is the first step in throwing Christians to the lions.

They boo-hoo about how persecuted they are, even tho the California Department of Corrections stated, in one of their first briefs in court, " certain “traditional” faiths are first tier faiths and that those faiths were meant to have equal rights and protections under the United States Constitution, but that all of the other faiths, for example, Hindus, Pagans, Buddhists, Sikhs, Mormons, Jehovah’s Witnesses, Jains, are second tier faiths deserving of lesser rights, and therefore are not meant to have the same equal rights and protections under the United States Constitution as the first tier faiths."

(http://bosefius.xanga.com/721146854/congress-shall-make-no-law-respecting-an-establishment-of-religion-or-prohibiting-the-free-exercis/)

Yup, you have an arm of the government officially declaring non-Christian (and also JW's and Mormons) are second class religions. And the conservative group "WallBuilders" supporting this claim. (They should be called WallBUSTERS, because they want to tear down the wall separating church and state, and establish a THEOCRACY where Chrisians rule, (their brand of Christians) and everyone is second class)

But despite the special priveledges from the gov't to Christians and declaration of second class status to all others, there are still that noisy few boo-hooing about how persecuted they are, because they aren't allowed to beat up gays, or forbid them from marrying.

And YES, second tier religion means the exact same thing as second class. One of the definitions of "Tier" is "class" or "ranking". And now the Christian Nationalist have become bolder, and are outright stating that anyone who is not one of them is second class.

Yup,

iVillage Member
Registered: 04-18-2006
Wed, 02-10-2010 - 2:54pm

Pretty gross. I expected this from Texas maybe, but not California.

Course in my state, my state senate rep decided to get on his soap box (when he really should be getting the budget finalized that was due in June!) and state in a state senate why a federal policy/law (don't know which) Don't ask don't tell, should remain.

Told a story about when he was in the military in the 80's when being closeted and gay was enough to get kicked out, he was almost made to room mates (the horror) and all the bad things that he did (pot smoking and awol). He wasn't kicked out for being gay, but the other stuff, but somehow the other stuff was because he was gay. And gays have no place because they the type of people are about themselves, individualists he called them.
Really bad argument.

Photobucket
My Two Monsters!

"Reality has a well known liberal bias" - Stephan Colbert

O Lord Lead me from the unreal to the real.
Lead me from the darkness to light.
Lead me from death to immortality.
May there be peace, peace, and perfect peace.
Brihadaranyaka Upanishads (1.3.28)
Photobucket
iVillage Member
Registered: 02-18-2006
Wed, 02-10-2010 - 4:30pm
Oy.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"'Cause love's such an old-fashioned word, and love dares you to care for the people on th
iVillage Member
Registered: 04-18-2006
Wed, 02-10-2010 - 5:19pm

I need to post the video link. Some one there taped it and posted it to youtube. I'll do it right now.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3E6eeSU34EM

Photobucket
My Two Monsters!

"Reality has a well known liberal bias" - Stephan Colbert

O Lord Lead me from the unreal to the real.
Lead me from the darkness to light.
Lead me from death to immortality.
May there be peace, peace, and perfect peace.
Brihadaranyaka Upanishads (1.3.28)
Photobucket