SAH IS HARMFUL!!!

iVillage Member
Registered: 12-12-2002
SAH IS HARMFUL!!!
2888
Thu, 07-08-2004 - 11:32am

Or at least this woman thinks so.

Okmrsmommy-36, CPmom to DD-16 and DS-14

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iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Mon, 08-16-2004 - 9:09am

"You sound like a very organized person. I myself am probably not nearly as organized as you are and I know my limits. "


Yes, it takes determination, organization and a tolerance for a very busy life to WOH FT and have children.

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iVillage Member
Registered: 07-14-2004
Mon, 08-16-2004 - 2:57pm
I know it can be done and as a sahm my life is busy too. I know ppl can be pretty defensive on this topic and if you read my posts you'll notice that I never said that everybody should make the same decision I have made. I too know women who woh ft and their kids are well-mannered and well-adjusted. I also know sahms with kids who have a lot of problems socially. Ppl are too quick to make generalizations and assume that a child's successes or shortcomings are directly attributed to the work status of the mom when there are so many other variables that come into play. My neighbor is a wohm and a wonderful parent to her two sons. I can just watch the way that she interacts with them and know that. Then the neighbor on the other side of her also is a married wohm ft who comes home stressed out and exhasuted and tells her kids, "Go play. Get out of my face." So her kids run around the neighborhood until dark while she and her husband stay inside the house doing whatever it is they do. They have actually locked the kids out of the house before so that they could have "peace and quiet". With this woman sah wouldn't have made the situation any better and I know this because she used to sah ft and she still closed herself up in the house while her kids ran around unsupervised all day. For her, sah or woh is simply a matter of geography because it's plainly obvious that her kids aren't high on her priority list. She works in the same office as my sister-in-law, so I know that this woman is lazy on the job and far from a model employee.


WOH FT isn't something that I have a burning desire to do and I'm comfortable with the choices dh and I have made concerning our lives and our family. When I do work an occasional shift I see wohms who I can tell would be very attentive and responsible parents, even though I don't see them with their children. I see this based on the way they perform their duties at work and the way they care for their patients. It only stands to reason that a contientious employee who made the conscious decision to maintain a career AND raise children would approach parenting with the same dedication that she gives to her career. As stated before I know I COULD do it but I am CHOOSING not to and I'm thankful to have a choice about it. If woh ft was something I wanted to do, I could hire a sitter to come to my home and take care of my kids, get them to their summer activities and their after-school classes during the school year. We have simply chosen not to go that route and it's working out well. Sah ft isn't for everybody; one size does NOT fit all.

Personally, I think there is far too much animosity between sahms and wohms without any benefit to anybody. I've always wondered why this is. I mean, in other areas of our lives we can make choices that are different from what our friends, relatives, neighbors and aquaintances have made and most of the time nobody cares. My neighbor doesn't care that I drive a SUV while she drives a van. I don't care that they prefer to vacation in the mountains while we prefer the beach. We are Protestant and they are Catholic and it doesn't matter. Nor does it matter that she woh ft while I sah (at least it doesn't matter to either of us). She and I talked about this once and neither of us can understand why this is such a hot topic for debate and why ppl can be so judgemental. The main thing I got from that talk with my former supervisor was to follow my instincts when making the decision and not to let ppls. negative comments about my choice sway me into one that I'd regret in the end. And looking back, I think if I had decided to go back to work ft it would have been a bad decision for ME.

I guess the debate rages hot because no matter what our choices, we resent other ppl telling us how to live our lives and raise our kids. I have had demeaning comments made to me for staying home and my neighbor has faced similar treatment from ppl. who don't agree with her decision. But these same ppl. who feel the need to comment on either situation probably wouldn't be heard saying, "I can't believe you bought a Ford. I have a Chevy and it's better. There must be something wrong with you for not wanting to drive around in a Chevy like I do." That's really how silly it all sounds sometimes. So, why do YOU think this is such a hot topic?

BTW, I just recently quit going to the MOPS group at my church for a reason that would probably surprise some ppl. The mentor of the group, a 67 yo grandmother who had raised 6 kids of her own (mostly as a sahm) at first tried to sound impartial but in time I noticed comments from her mouth that were negative toward wohms. Keep in mind that the mission of MOPS International, according to their own literature, is to provide support to all mothers, regardless of age, race, marital status, religion or employment (or lack of). Some of her comments made me cringe--and I am a sahm. I think there should have been two mentors, one who had been a sahm and another wohm in order to meet the needs of both. I spoke up and told her what I had been noticing and that I thought such comments were undermining the purpose of MOPS (Mothers of Preschoolers) but of course she didn't see it at all. She kept saying that she wanted to give sahms the support they need and deserve. But why must we cut wohms down in order to give support to sahms? I don't understand it myself and I resented the implication that I would all of a sudden become a sub-standard parent given a change in my life's circumstances (i.e having to go back to work). And the mentor kept saying that she couldn't understand why it upset me so since I'm a sahm. (So was she intending to offend the wohms?) I know this has been a lengthy post. The point I want to leave you with is that although I sah and I believe in what I'm doing, that is not to say that those who don't do as I do are wrong. I know better than that and I can feel good about being a sahm without cutting down wohms.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Mon, 08-16-2004 - 4:10pm

"We have simply chosen not to go that route and it's working out well. Sah ft isn't for everybody; one size does NOT fit all. "


I agree, no one answer fits everyone.

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iVillage Member
Registered: 07-14-2004
Mon, 08-16-2004 - 6:08pm
I understand why ppl have strong opinions. What I don't understand is why ppl. seem to think that what they do is better (not just for them but everyone else too) and the idea that wohms don't care about their kids or they would be sah; or that sahms are lazy and eat bon bons in front of the TV all day. And the moms who choose pt sah and pt woh get it from both sides.

I have strong opinions as to what is right for my family and I believe in what I do just as you do. Believing in my choices doesn't mean I devalue others'.

What touches a nerve with me are comments that imply that sahms have no value in society because they aren't bringing home a paycheck and comments that want to liken us to welfare mothers who sponge off the system. I worked since the age of 16 and stopped working at the age of 29 after the birth of my son. Dh is a highly paid professional who supports our family financially and pays his share of taxes. I now work very minimally and I pay taxes as well. I just don't understand how sah wives of professional men are at all similar to welfare moms. I am privileged to be able to be at home. I am supported financially by dh, not by the tax dollars of the working public.

I understand that the posters here feel strongly about doing the best possible job of raising their children and you and I are both doing just that, we're just going about it differently and I just don't believe that the negative stereotypes apply in either case. Yes, I'm sure that there are a few women out there who aren't very devoted to their kids and there are also some who like to sit around and eat bon-bons all day, but those are far extremes that in most cases just don't apply.

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-14-2004
Mon, 08-16-2004 - 7:30pm
I never came away with the impression that she was necessarily saying that others would suffer as she did if they chose to woh. A quick look around easily proves that to be untrue. The message I came away with and based on her situation was that it CAN be disastrous if it's not totally your decision. She said, "You can't have it all." I think you took that to mean something completely different from the way I took that comment. I agree with that and I'm going to explain why. I believe that it is possible to have both a full-time career and to raise children. However, allowances need to be made to accomodate it. Before I met dh I was briefly engaged to someone else. He came from a family that believed that women shouldn't sah AT ALL--no matter what the reason or circumstances. And as we talked about our future, here is what he expected.

1. I was to work full-time night shift from 11-7. He'd leave for work at 8:30 after which I would stay up all day with our kids because he didn't want to pay childcare.

2. This was to continue up until they reached schoolage, at which point I was to homeschool them during the day, after working all night.

3. The house was to be clean and spotless and dinner was to be on the table as soon as he walked in the door. After dinner, he would then go to the gym for his daily workout while I stayed at home with the kids, cleaned up the dinner mess, bathed the kids and put them to bed.

4. When he came home from the gym I was to run for an hour. After all, he couldn't have his wife being overweight could he? Then I was to put on my uniform and head off to work the night shift.

5. He would not be doing any cooking or cleaning and would only change diapers in the middle of the night while I was at work. But if I was around, that sort of stuff was "women's work" and he shouldn't have to do it.

6. If the kids were involved with activities after school or evenings and weekends, getting them there was my responsibility. His job (computer operator) just left him feeling really stressed at the end of the workday and he wasn't to be bothered with those extras. (and nursing is a stress-free occupation? Puhleez!!).

7. He was to be in control of every aspect of our finances and I was to sign my paychecks over to him and follow whatever budget he set. (Now keep in mind that I was making TWICE what he was).

8. I was to breastfeed my babies each for 18 months because he didn't want to have to buy formula. He also didn't want the expense of a breast pump and said I could do it manually.

9. I was not to be seen outside without my make-up on or with my hair messed up. It would reflect badly if I looked like I didn't take care of myself.

10. I was to nap for an hour during the afternoon when the kids were to nap. That should be sufficient to last me until the next afternoon when the kids napped.

11. I was to grow vegetables in the garden behind our house to cut down on expenses at the grocery store. I should easily be able to fit in a little gardening after working full-time, staying home and homeschooling kids during the day, cleaning the house, cooking, laundry, a daily workout, driving around to various kids' activities, breastfeeding or manually pumping myself and making sure my hair and make-up were always perfect.

12. Since I knew how to change oil in the cars and he didn't, well I could do that too. We certainly don't want to pay for it and I should have plenty of time, shouldn't I?

13. He wanted to breed cocker spaniels to bring in a littel extra $$ and since I would be home during the day, I could take care of that too.

14. He wanted to have family gatherings once a month and I was responsible for the planning of these too.

15. There was absolutely no reason he could see for me to have more than one work uniform. Just wash it everyday and keep wearing it.

As you can see, he expected me to literally do it all. I'm not Superwoman, I can't do it all. Neither can you because nobody can be in two places at once and we all need to sleep sometime. He wanted to have it both ways and I don't think the most capable, energetic mother in the world could realistically live up to those expectations. That is why I agree with the statement that we can't have it all and do it all because we can't. We have our limitations.

Thankfully, I didn't marry that man and instead found somebody who shares my values and supports me in all I do. I agree with what you said in one of your other posts about divorce being a positive thing. It sure would have been for me if I had married my first fiance. Now hopefully you'll understand where I was coming from in agreeing with the statement about not being able to do it all.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-18-2004
Mon, 08-16-2004 - 7:45pm

OK, please. Tell me what you could have found REMOTELY attractive in such a control freak!! Was he a hunk or something!??? LOL


I'm glad you got out of that gig before it ever started! Good lord.

Mondo

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-14-2004
Mon, 08-16-2004 - 8:30pm
To be completely truthful, I don't think I ever really loved him now that I look back on it. I was 26 yrs. old and not yet married and feeling a little pressure from family members, plus a lot of my younger cousins were getting married. As I look back now I can realize how silly I was being about it all but I felt like family members had pretty much written me off as destined to end up as an old spinster. I met him, he liked me at first but there was no attraction on my part. Still, at the time he seemed nice enough so I figured I'd give him a chance. I honestly think that I talked myself into thinking I could love him (and he was telling me he loved me after our third date). Eventually we became engaged and began living together and that's when we started having long talks about what we wanted our lives to be. I had always wished to be a sahm but realized that it would depend a lot on financial circumstances. I wasn't close-minded about being a wohm but obviously allowances need to be made somewhere to make it physically possible and he wouldn't budge. I did lots of soul searching and realized that I was settling. I realized that if I never ever got married as I had hopes to do, my life would still be a hell of a lot better than it ever could be with him. So I broke off the engagement, concentrated on nursing and pretty much figured that would be my life. Then about 18 mos. later I met my husband.

No, my ex was far from a hunk...and I might add lousy in the sack too. It was temporary insanity on my part. I occasionally run into my ex. He's now 37 and remains unmarried. I don't think he'll have many takers but I could be wrong. I hope I'm right though because I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy.

Avatar for nativcalgal
iVillage Member
Registered: 10-25-2003
Mon, 08-16-2004 - 10:30pm
And I thought the guy I actually did marry when I was 18 was bad! Yeesh! I divorced him 9 years and 2 kids later.....but he was nothing close to what your ex fiance was! I feel sorry for whoever married that DORK! Thank goodness you smartened up!

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Avatar for nativcalgal
iVillage Member
Registered: 10-25-2003
Mon, 08-16-2004 - 10:33pm
Actually, I'm embarrassed to even say I was married to him for that long! LOL

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iVillage Member
Registered: 07-14-2004
Tue, 08-17-2004 - 8:14am
Why are you so certain that I would disagree. I think there were multiple issues there. Her ex husband was CEO of a large corporation and could very well have supported the family with his income. She told me that after she had her first son, she wanted to sah but he wouldn't allow it and wouldn't even allow her to cut back her hours, so she put on a happy face and tried to grin and bear it. All those years she told herself that what she was doing was more important than sah with her kids, that she was bringing home a paycheck, she was an educated, independent woman, etc. But in the end none of that mattered because her heart wasn't in it. It wasn't her decision and what made it worse for her, she told me, was that the double income wasn't necessary, he just didn't value what she did. So yes, it had much to do with her marriage. They didn't see eye-to-eye. I'm sure that there are sahms in the same predicament that she was in who would like to go back to work but husband doesn't want them to. I have a cousin in that position now.

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