Which came first, the title or the SAHW?

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-21-2003
Which came first, the title or the SAHW?
1695
Fri, 12-19-2003 - 9:04am
Last night I attended my husband's work Christmas party. I sat with the CEO, CFO, CTO, COO (Chief operations officer, I didn't know that acronym, I had to ask), Creative Director, Marketing Director and their wives. Near the end of the evening it was just we wives chatting mostly about kids. I made the observation that even though all the wives were intelligent, educated and accomplished women, not a single one (except me), woh. They are all SAHM's.

Any thoughts on why that might be? I have my own opinion but I'd like to hear from everyone else first. Do you think they sah because of their husbands jobs or their husbands have their jobs because the wives stay home? Or doesn't it matter?

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iVillage Member
Registered: 12-02-2003
Tue, 12-30-2003 - 11:37am
Man you read a lot into what I said. I said that some wouldn't make a difference if they WOH and they wouldn't. I said nothing about these mysterious contributions SAHM's make to the household that no one seems to be able to put a name on but we're supposed to accept as real, lol.
iVillage Member
Registered: 12-02-2003
Tue, 12-30-2003 - 11:41am
Yes, I'm talking about moms who could benefit their families by WOH. And I do understand long term goals taking priority. In my mind, you'd have to have a good reason not to do something that you know would benefit your family and there is nothing, intrinsic, about SAH that would override the benefit from mom WOH if her WOH is a benefit (sorry but I just see nothing better about SAH to offset the loss of a known benefit if moms working would be such a benefit). Sounds like you chose between benefits the one you liked best based on your situation. Hence you have a reason to not go after the benefits from WOH. Sometimes we can't have it all.
iVillage Member
Registered: 12-02-2003
Tue, 12-30-2003 - 11:49am
ignore this. Thought it didn't post and posted again.


Edited 12/30/2003 11:52:44 AM ET by cyndluagain
iVillage Member
Registered: 12-02-2003
Tue, 12-30-2003 - 11:51am
LOL, the sigh was for me. I have to wash the floors. She used to clean houses with her son in tow and didn't feel she could adequately keep an eye on two kids so she quit.

No, my time with my kids didn't increase/decrease by much based on my work status because it didn't need to. I've always had enough time regardless of my work status.

If your concern is how much fun you have, go for it.

Avatar for outside_the_box_mom
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Tue, 12-30-2003 - 11:51am
I'm not a big fan of Disney movies although Finding Nemo was ok. But then my DH watched it the other night for the first time and said it was highly traumatic -- to him!

If I could have picked an ideal provider, I would have chosen you or Tinzer. You both sound like wonderful providers. The "stupid Disney movie" comment is a real life scenario. I have stated this already, but I chose one of my providers because she had an ECE degree and a space set up downstairs in her home that was very much like a preschool classroom. She said taught the children colors, their ABCs, and how to count. Well, she never did that. By that time I got to her, I think she was burned out. She sat the kids in front of Disney most of the time. I didn't find out until DS started talking -- when he started talking about all the movies he had seen! Well, he hadn't seen them under my watch!

I get frustrated when I read that children do better in daycare or that daycare providers can provide everything a parent can or that there is no benefit to SAH. In my case, that simply was not true.

outside_the_box_mom

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-08-2003
Tue, 12-30-2003 - 11:59am
nope. if you looked at the threads on these topics--the good number of sahps who insist that they don't sah to clean the house and run errands but to focus on the kids (don't necessarily if at all get the errands run and housecleaning done and the like while their dhs are at work), the only partially intersecting population of sahps who catalog how much more work sah creates for them to do (spend more time chauffering and engaging children, running errands, and doing housework specificially because they sah), and the rest--you'd see that these things are hardly universal or even comparable. heck, for that matter, whose family isn't freed up in the evening? i'm hardly a night owl, but i'm able to fit an awful lot of the mundane in around breaks at work and after my kids go to bed among other times; maintaining a household isn't necessarily massively time consuming. regarding the childcare matters, not every dc user uses a kennel--most dcs, like mine, offer children the same type of appropriate activities, such as outdoor play and trips to the library, in that "80-120-combined" hours, which makes that particular calculation meaningless regarding the opportunities for activities that you itemized in your last post.

nice math, by the way. a dual income couple works "a combined" 80-120 hours and a single-income couple works "a combined" 40-60 hours--and that means what? a sahp hardly has an "extra" 40-60 hours a week to do yardwork, since she will at some point have to perform some childcare--especially if she's offering her child any of those opportunities to go to the park, museum, library , etc. that you itemized in your last post. wax as poetic as you will about how much your children enjoy running every errand with you, but you can't have it both ways--either your children have x number of additional hours of potential museum time or you are not running the household errands that you itemized as other universal benefits. the commitment a sahp makes to childcare has to be factored into that "combined" time somehow--that is, unless you're arguing that sahps are bon-bon eating slugs or that dual-income couples have 40-60 hours a week of household chores to fit in around their jobs.

just because it isn't as easy to sort out who will sah with a sick child if both parents work doesn't mean that it is always or especially difficult. if *two* parents are willing to organize their work so that they are at least usually available to their children, there are fewer conflicts than if neither does so or even if either one doesn't, and if two parents are commited to this conflicts are likely to be very rare if they occur at all. many dual-income families build the same "slack" into their work lives that having a sahp can provide whether or not both parents are willing to make their children a priority--the "slack" that a family will need *only* if either parent isn't willing to do that. the "slack" isn't inherent nor exclusive to sah; it's pretty darn outrageous to suggest that most dual-income families live without it, just because some sahps have to or choose to cut it for their working spouses.

but that's neither here nor there. the examples that you say represent "slack" merely represent normal life for most families. when what you post *depends* on such complicated disclaimiers as during-normal-workweek-hours-on-nonvacation-weekdays-without-taking-time-off-work-and-without-a-nonparent and during-normal-workweek-hours-on-nonvacation-weekdays-without-taking-time-off-work-and-by-a-parent-and-only-a-parent, you aren't talking about anything meaningful. good dc and good parents offer children very comparable experiences--whether the parents use dc or not.

while you might have listed advantages that fit your own circumstances (because your dh and/or you weren't willing to adjust your work and household situations or habits to suit family life unless you opted out of the workforce entirely), you also listed things that are part-and-parcel of my dual-income family's life--apart from those complicated and meaningless ammendments that require that we maintain inflexible jobs or a bloated sense of self-importance surrounding them, a belief that our children would be shortchanged by making some of their trips to the library with others and hearing books read by others and a host of other extraordinary factors. your examples aren't by any means universal to and they aren't even remotely exclusive to sah; as i said, they reflect normal life for most dual-income families as well as most families with a sahp.

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-21-2003
Tue, 12-30-2003 - 12:01pm
You really think so? I thought it was ridiculous. Honestly, to insinuate that a family with 2 wohps has as much time as a family with a sahp, and can accomplish everything from staying home with a sick child, to cleaning the house, to hanging around for repairmen with the same ease is just plain absurd. I know that when dh was home for a few days and I came home to a clean house, cooked dinner and all I had to do was my yoga, it was nirvana.

If anyone is buying that load I've got a bridge to sell them. I noticed the poster never woh ft with kids. If it's so effortless I wonder what she's waiting for.

Avatar for laurenmom2boys
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-25-2003
Tue, 12-30-2003 - 12:05pm
<<"I stayed home with Johnny last time he was sick, I've got a presentation, it's your turn", "No, I've got to be in Atlanta, I can't stay home with him", then I wonder if you even have children. It's not a breeze.>> Nope, never happened to us because a) neither DH nor I travel for business - ever, and b) because if the boys are sick I stay home and either work from home or take a vacation day, unless of course it's DH's day off. He can't very well cancel out a day full of patients for a sick child, so I'm always the one who stays home or picks them up from school if they're sick. And you don't have to question whether or not we have children.

As far as running errands, etc., DH does most of them on his lunch hour or on his way home from work. It doesn't take hours to pick up milk or his shirts from the cleaners. And I have someone come in once a week to clean. We have lots of down time and family time to relax together.

If we need a home repair or service we schedule it for DH's day off or I'll take a day off. No big deal.

Avatar for laurenmom2boys
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-25-2003
Tue, 12-30-2003 - 12:08pm
When my boys were in DC they could bring in a movie one day a week and movie time was for one hour on that day. I also love those "stupid Disney movies." We've made some very good MEMORIES watching those movies together or bringing the boys to see them in the theater.
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Tue, 12-30-2003 - 12:31pm
Raising my hand here. Yes, I can accomplish all those things with ease. My dd was sick the week before Christmas, no biggie, I just called work and said I wouldn't be in. We got ds a TV for Christmas so the cable guy is coming Friday. No biggie, I'll be there. School is out til next Tuesday, no problem, dh is off today and Wed, I am off Friday and Mon. I just did my calendar for January. I have a dr appointment on a Monday morning, the kids have a dentist appointment on a Thurs afternoon. I have a standing hair appt every 4 weeks on a Tuesday afternoonDs has cub scouts and basketball every MOnday and Tues. Dd has baton practice every Monday and Friday. I do all my shopping on Thurs afternoons so I don't have to do errands on the weekends and ds loves coming with me. My house is clean and I cook every night. I'm home everday by 3pm and go back to work 1 night a week, while dh wtches the kids and takes dd to Bible Study. The kids have two school holidays in Jan, I'll be home for both.

I work FT. It's really not a big deal. I've been doing it for nearly 15 years.

Susan

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