WOH/Kids/Feminism: WDYT?

iVillage Member
Registered: 12-29-2004
WOH/Kids/Feminism: WDYT?
1456
Tue, 02-08-2005 - 9:06am

Okay, let's debate something else. One morning a few months ago, I was crabby to DH about having to get ready for work. DH said, "Well, if you don't want to go to work, quit!"

Later that day, I told him I was just venting, and then I told him some of the reasons I really do like WOH. One reason was something to the effect that I wanted to WOH as part of at-home feminism for our DD's. He said he had no idea what I was talking about.

I thought about it some and decided that although this is a heartfelt idea for me, it's still fuzzy. I suppose I meant that I want to show my DDs how to live independently of a man, in the sense of income, ability to make one's way in the world, and so on, even if they choose marriage & kids. My feelings of pride in my own mom, who was a WOH mom, come into it, too.

Caution: I don't mean in any way to suggest anything the least bit negative about SAH moms. That's not what this is about. Nor do I mean to suggest that anyone has to WOH to teach their kids feminist or gender neutral values. That's not what this is about, either.

Do you think there's any value in WOH as part of raising kids? Please help me clarify my thinking.

Sabina

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iVillage Member
Registered: 03-18-2004
Thu, 02-10-2005 - 1:14pm

I think it may be, depending on how you handle yourself and your marriage.

Mondo

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-28-2003
Thu, 02-10-2005 - 1:21pm

You: "red is the best color."
Me: "I disagree. Blue is."
That would be an example of disagreeing.

You: "Some people take their kids to the museum to teach art appreciation."
Me: "I don't go to museums, but I do a great job of teaching my kids art appreciation."
That would be an example of being defensive. There was no mention of people who don't go to museums not doing a good job of teaching art appreciation yet it was heard that way (or responded that way). To me, that's what's going on in this thread.

And the reason I used the term "some sahms" was because we are talking about sahms and wohms. Didn't you say it yourself? "read the title of this message board?"
How is saying "some" sahms implying that it's a general standard? If I said, "some" men are jerks, am I implaying that "all" men are jerks?

iVillage Member
Registered: 01-29-2004
Thu, 02-10-2005 - 1:22pm
Not right now. I'm kind of settled in. But like you, I agree that to not work at all does seem like a waste of an education.
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
Thu, 02-10-2005 - 1:23pm

"But dh and I are both happy with our work lives. The kids see that and maybe plan on working themselves someday." You are patting yourself on the back WAY too hard. Do you think that it's your job that will inspire your kids to "maybe work someday"? What alternative do they have. Well, there are two:

1)live with you without holding a job until marriage- then get married but still don't hold a job even before having kids

2) welfare

Unless they live one of those 2 scenarios- they WILL hold jobs regardless of whether you do or not. That is why I think it's so daft to think your job has anything to do with their future jobs. They have NO ALTERNATIVE but to hold a job unless they are living one of the above 2 scenarios. And you can easily make the 1st scenario impossible by simply not allowing it.

Basically, your kids WILL have jobs regardless of what you do. THAT is why your work status is irrelevant as a role model. They have no choice but to hold jobs or unless you contrive to prevent them from doing so by encouraging them to live at home eternally without ever holding a job.

iVillage Member
Registered: 01-05-2005
Thu, 02-10-2005 - 1:26pm
I know what its like to live on a shoestring. No thanks, espceially with kids, forget it. I know how long it takes to find a good job, even from having one. No thanks on the unemployed for years option of that. I know what its like to look through job opportunties and cross them off because the overall demands don't suit family life - and thats family life with another parent invovled directly in it. Thinking about the stress there, when I NEED the job to provide for my family because I don't have one, thanks but no. I know what its like to budget minimum time off when one has kids, and that was from within a marriage where two adults were pooling time off resources to cover requirements. No way I'll ever be into doing that solo or with a disassociated-from-my-life adult. I'm entirely familiar with the childcare world, but I remember when I was learning the ropes. The cost alone, is a shocker. These are the reasons why I think having a decent job is such a bonus in life as a parent. I call it - reality. I don't get a good sense of reality from people who seem to blow off the difficulties of finding suitable work, let alone suitably profitable work, from an unemployed situation, or a barely employed situation. And I never have the idea that they have any clue about what even their lifestyle limitations and constraints are going to be, simply because they have kids. I don't usually get the idea that any of them have really ever lived with financial stress and uncertainty. I also know what the divorce statistics are, and live in a real world, where just about every divorce I've ever seen has surprised 50% of the invovled adults.
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-18-2004
Thu, 02-10-2005 - 1:29pm

I really don't mean to be contrarian.

Mondo

iVillage Member
Registered: 01-29-2004
Thu, 02-10-2005 - 1:32pm

I sooo agree. I hope I influence what kind of adults my children become. But I can't imagine that my influence stretches so far as to whether or not they aspire to sah or work when they have children! I'm really hoping to impress on them the importance of education and will hope they go to college and grad school even.

But to presume that I have any influence on how they raise their children is just out of my particular way of thinking. That would go beyond mothering (and falls into the realm of my MIL who still feels for some reason that we need her input on every decision!)

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
Thu, 02-10-2005 - 1:40pm
Ok. Good point. However, in order for scenario #1 to work, the parents must be willing to support the jobless adult girl until such time as she marries (a given in many cultures). However, Sabmarianes posts have led me to believe that scenario #1 is NOT something she'd be willing to support (since she WANTS he dd's to be employed) and without parental support, it just can't happen. Therefore, unless she WANTS to support a jobless daughter till she marries a man who doesn't want her to hold a job, it won't happen, regardless of Sabramarin'es own work status and example.
iVillage Member
Registered: 01-05-2005
Thu, 02-10-2005 - 1:42pm
She was failing to model independance only if her kids knew where her money went. If they didn't, why would they not assume both mom and dads money was used to pay for the cost of their lives?
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Thu, 02-10-2005 - 1:43pm
No, I beg to differ.

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