Working for Lifestyle/Extras

iVillage Member
Registered: 12-22-2005
Working for Lifestyle/Extras
3621
Mon, 11-20-2006 - 11:13am

Hi Ladies :)

This is my first time on this debate board and I have been dying to jump into some of the topics, but I feel as though they are sooooo long (one in particular is over 1000 replies, yikes!) that starting my own specific one might work out better.

Anyhow, a recurring theme here seems to be what Moms should and shouldn't be going to work for. It seems some are of the opinion that is OK for Mom to work if she must to pay her bills but NOT if its to afford a nice car, house, good neighborhood. This is considered keeping up with the Johnses (who are they???) and thats bad.

Well, I want to know what in the heck is wrong with a women working to have nice things? I don't mean working and leaving baby in child care 16 hours a day, everyday...thats pretty extreme.

I enjoyed a certain lifestyle before having a child, should I have downsized that lifestyle once baby came so I didn't have to work? What about me *wanting* to maintain a certain lifestyle for myself, my husband, and my child makes me a (a) workaholic or (b) striving to keep up with the Joneses?

Don't some people (like myself) simply enjoy living in a nice place with nice things and want their children to have the same experience?

So please, anyone who thinks a women is wrong for WOH if she is not doing so to financially survive but does it to maintain a certain lifestyle...whats wrong with this?

Thanks all :)

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iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Sat, 12-16-2006 - 2:02pm
The whole book is very good.

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iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Sat, 12-16-2006 - 2:03pm
ROFL thanks so much for the laughs.

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iVillage Member
Registered: 10-31-2005
Sat, 12-16-2006 - 2:24pm

Do you have any evidence for this? While I've seen research on the early effects of SAH/WOH, I have yet to see any stats on the long-term effects of SAH or WOH on teenagers and young adults.

iVillage Member
Registered: 08-12-2003
Sat, 12-16-2006 - 2:27pm
Would I be correct in assuming that Mr. Ramsey does not provide his financial

 

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
Sat, 12-16-2006 - 2:38pm
He tries not to provide it for free. But you can pry it out of the book (for free) on Amazon by using their "search inside this book" feature. I just now went and did it because he's become the subthread's focus. Some pages are blocked, but I was able to "leaf" through the book for free (minus a few blocked pages) on Amazon. It's pretty basic stuff. Much of it seems pretty fear-based but he pitches it at people who are already in way over their heads and don't have a clue that living far beyond their means in conjunction with paying the minimum on the credit card is a fast-track to bankruptcy. For those who by nature or nurture are already cautious and prudent, it's utterly useless.
iVillage Member
Registered: 10-31-2005
Sat, 12-16-2006 - 2:40pm

From listening to the radio show, I believe the steps are as follows (to the best of my memory), and yes, he recommends following them in this order:

1. Save up $1,000 emergency fund.
2. Pay off credit card debt and car loans. (Sell cars you can't afford and replace them with reliable used cars. Pay the smallest debts first to "gain traction" and motivation to pay off the next debts.)
3. Save up 3-6 months living expenses.
4. Begin retirement contributions. (I might have steps 3 and 4 reversed.)
5. Pay off school loans/mortgage.
6. Save for kids' college. (Ramsey doesn't seem to be a big believer in saving for an Ivy League education. He sees no problem with kids living at home and commuting to a local university, for example. He also doesn't recommend that students take on loans--or at least large loans--to attend a 'dream school.')

I believe that the idea is that after debt is paid off, you can put more money aside for retirement and college. So, for example, if a $1,500/month morgage is paid off, that money is now available to contribute to college expenses.

Now it makes sense to me that in a market where mortgages can be found for 6% and investments earmarked for a child's college education can earn 8% that steps 5 and 6 should probably be reversed. But no one, including my bank's investment specialist, can seem to tell me a place where I can guarantee over 5% earnings right now. DH's 401(K) currently is doing much better than that but he also lost about $40,000 over the past five years in it.

So it would seem that Ramsey's approach is a low-risk one, understandable considering he lost huge amounts of money and went bankrupt in real estate back in the '80s.

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-31-2005
Sat, 12-16-2006 - 2:48pm

I agree that gifted students need a different track. Many gifted, or even extremely motivated, students are incredibly bored in classes that don't offer an honors option. The fact is that they just don't need as much reteaching and catch on to most concepts faster. Some educators attempt to meet their skill level by assigning these students more advanced work, but it's unfair for them to have to complete more difficult work for the same grade as a much less advanced student. I think that's why high schools (at least in our area) offer more grade points for an A in AP Physics than an A in IPC (Integrated Physics and Chemistry, the 9th grade regular science class).

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-27-2006
Sat, 12-16-2006 - 2:57pm

K'nex (whether motorized or not--we actually prefer the solar powered jobs) These help build mathematics, logistics, short and long term planning depending on the project, fine motor skills, hand-eye coordination, depth-perception and togetherness among probably many others I can't think of right now but I know we incorporate time management skills into the larger projects since they can't take forever as space is limited in our home.

Leap Pad for babies (don't recall the actual name and it's in the attic with the luggage) (saves my sanity in the car on trips--which we take often considering we don't live near any family and don't fly often. This one has saved me through my three youngest children and we generally only use it on trips so that it's "new" or at least something of interest again) The books and cartridges we have purchased are similar to any board book you'd buy for an infant with simple objects you'd find around the home each day. They can play with it in English or Spanish and it's the only electronic interactive game I'd ever recommend for the 6mo and up young folks, personally.

Multiplication Bingo (not electronic)

Geography bingo (not electronic)

Lingo Bingo (not electronic)

Twist n Shout by Leap Frog Multiplication, Division, Addition, and Subtraction (all separate hand helds) We love this one instead of flash cards because there are several challenge functions including speed.

Our boys like to play a flight game called Ace Combat IV. I don't care for video games much but this one is great, imo. Our boys have an inclination toward piloting and this provides a good experience for the hand-eye coordination and thinking skills that will be required and expanded upon when they begin their flight hours. It isn't the best in "flight simulating" but it provides another plus for our boys in that it has served to help them become interested in the military aviation their father is so interested in. When we go to the library my boys skip the fiction and head to the books on anything about the military in the reference section. Our oldest boy has already begun his journey by being invited to and participating in a flight camp called "Young Eagles" in our community. Harrison Ford is the sponsor of this one.

I don't know, we don't have a lot of electronic games but we do have a few like a Game Boy Advance (again...this one is for the car trips and is put up with the luggage), PS2, XBox (2 of these) and our boys do have a television in their bedroom for playing their games. They have to earn the privilege of playing it each day for the 30 minute time limit per day. Saturday is a free day if dad is home an d the weather is bad...they can play all they want but they usually opt to get a game of monopoly going after an hour or so of the video games.

Our children have so many board games I can't count them all. They know that playing electronics is a privilege and they also know they only get a certain amount of time. There is no getting extra time per day or saving time from previous days for future days.

I think the best game we have in the house is our chess board.

I know I haven't relayed all the "what does it do for you". I guess I think it's probably understandable what each one provides. And I agree, we could get all the benefits from more natural means but it's fun to play some of this stuff and I don't have a problem with having them or using them because our children aren't let loose on them at will. They are treated as privileges and since I'm home with them all day, I keep a tight reign on the time factors and earning of the particular privilege. I'm very strict about the 30 minute rule in our home. The asset factor comes through the educational benefits gained as well as the enjoyability.

The idea that our children have to learn only in a "natural" setting just doesn't make sense to me. While I don't believe in pushing educational toys on children I don't also believe in withholding them if there is an interest and a healthy understanding that it is a privilege to be earned.

"Besides this we have our living prophet, for whom I am grateful, and I hope to follow after him all the days of my life.&

iVillage Member
Registered: 08-27-2005
Sat, 12-16-2006 - 3:02pm
I think one first has to define which stats are important. What defines a "wonderful" teen or adult and what defines a "failure"? For more obvious things such as drug/alcohol rates, teen pregnancy, teen violence etc., some stats are available. One could, for example, compare rates in countries where having a SAHP is more prevalent to rates in countries where having dual WOHPs is more prevalent.
iVillage Member
Registered: 11-27-2006
Sat, 12-16-2006 - 3:03pm

I think there is a benefit to be gained for society when a child is tended to personally by their mother. I think the child is nurtured better and more successfully by mother than by a care giver because it is natural for her to care for her own child.

You know, I have been wondering. For women who think that education should come from more natural means I think it's weird that you don't also understand the correlation between bearing or adopting the child and personally tending to them throughout their daily life as opposed to giving that over to a care provider instead.

I think it's unnatural to have a child in a care setting and you think it's fine. You think it's unnatural to put an electronic gadget in front of a child and I think it's fine.

Both for the same reasons.

"Besides this we have our living prophet, for whom I am grateful, and I hope to follow after him all the days of my life.&

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