Interesting Link

Avatar for jamblessedthree
iVillage Member
Registered: 10-23-2001
Interesting Link
352
Sat, 10-19-2013 - 4:49pm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zYs8toIE9fY

As an advocate and student studying health + human services this scenario is sad and I'm glad child welfare is involved.  WDYT?  Is there a break down of the system, according to her, here or is this just somebody placing the blame on others? 

 

 

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Avatar for jamblessedthree
iVillage Member
Registered: 10-23-2001
Sun, 10-20-2013 - 11:00am

Ah, no no no mops. You prove for me that mental illness is LIKE other illnesses. You go as far as to call others' opinions ignorant that don't agree that it is like other illnesses then don't want to support your own slanted views, Lol.  I told you why I don't see it like OTHER illnesses, Support why you think it is, Thanks. 

 

 

Avatar for rollmops2009
iVillage Member
Registered: 02-24-2009
Sun, 10-20-2013 - 11:02am
Jams, no, you have not in any way explained why you don't think it is like other illnesses. You said something about it being incurable, but that is true of many other diseases as well, so that is not an argument. I do not need to support my opinion with studies. It is accepted fact that mental illness is a chronic, treatable illness.
iVillage Member
Registered: 09-01-2002
Sun, 10-20-2013 - 11:34am

jamblessedthree wrote:
<p>Does treatment help mental illness go away? Tell that to a grown person that has done so much harm first... No, it's not like a disease like cancer or heart disease.</p><p>BTW, was she represented by a lawyer at court?  If she was then she was coached what to say too. </p>

I don't know if she had a lawyer, but she sounds like it.  The court will usually appoint a free lawyer for 2 reasons: the person is charged with a crime; the person's in jeopardy of losing her freedom, i.e., being committed to a mental health facility.

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-01-2002
Sun, 10-20-2013 - 11:40am

jamblessedthree wrote:
Throwing hands up in the air, Ok let's pretend there's some mental illness underneath her actions and behaviors. Now what? Can you make her go into treatment? What about those poor kids? You can't make her do anything, Those kids can be helped however, and the hope is to stop repeatable behaviors.

Yah, I think the court can force her to be institutionalized until she gets better.  You're right that she could be completely sane.  A few unbiased, state psychologists/psychiatrists would certify she's in need of institutional care for the moment.  And the children are SOL ~ place in foster care.  You and I share a conservative view on one thing ~ forced sterilization is not right.  Anyway, it's usually illegal (I say that because this is not always black and white.)  She could have a Guardian apointed for her by the courts and shockingly a Guardian with support of drs could get a court to order sterilization for her own good. 

There are no easy answers.

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-01-2002
Sun, 10-20-2013 - 11:44am

rollmops2009 wrote:
"Throwing hands up in the air, Ok let's pretend there's some mental illness underneath her actions and behaviors. Now what? Can you make her go into treatment? What about those poor kids?" ---------- Uhm, yes, of course you can make it a condition of her getting the kids back that she gets treatment and stays in treatment. I am sure that is also done for parents abusing alcohol or drugs, they have to stay clean and stay in AA or whatever to keep their kids.

Right.  But you can never force someone into treatment, like Jamblessed said.  In the US we have a constitution which says we cannot force anyone to act.

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-01-2002
Sun, 10-20-2013 - 11:52am

jamblessedthree wrote:
<p>mops, it's no surprise your approach to this is far opposite than the way I see it.  How schooled are you again?  I'm still learning myself.  Your approach to a lot of issues is far removed than the way I see it, Lately taking to debate even the pink causes which really insults the foundation of which others support.  We've discussed differences in how we react to family issues too, You know if cutting off complete ties from ones family is what's healthy for you who am I to argue that?  It certainly isn't advice I think all should take however. </p><p>Ignorance about mental illness is your perception and own hardened views. </p>

You're correct.  Different countries have different governing laws.  Our constitution forbids involuntary servitude (forcing the mom to do something) and requires a burden of proof stricter than that used for criminals *if* one's children are removed from her.  At a criminal trial, the burden of proof is proof beyond a reasonable doubt.  But to remove children from a parent, the burden of proof is clear and convincing evidence. 

Interesting stuff you must be studying in college.  I took one psychology course and loved it. Smile

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-01-2002
Sun, 10-20-2013 - 12:12pm

jamblessedthree wrote:
<p><blockquote class="quote-msg quote-nest-1 odd"><div class="quote-author"><em class="placeholder">bordwithyou</em> wrote:</div>There are many people who have issues with the "pink movement." Many of them are actually living with cancer.</blockquote></p><p>Ahh, So it's at the expense of others who are living with the cancer that actually do support the cause?  Wow!  I hope there's common ground somewhere...</p>

I think there is a lot of exploitation with the Breast Cancer movement in my country.  Mops wouldn't know nor should she presume to know as she does not live nor has she lived here as long as I've been an iVillage member.  Correct the mess that's Greece.  Then get back to us, lol.

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-01-2002
Sun, 10-20-2013 - 12:13pm

rollmops2009 wrote:
Jams, you said: "Does treatment help mental illness go away? Tell that to a grown person that has done so much harm first... No, it's not like a disease like cancer or heart disease." --------- It is very much a disease like many other chronic disease - diabetes, migraines, cancer etc.

Learned Doctor ~ are you actually claiming migraines are a disease? 

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-01-2002
Sun, 10-20-2013 - 12:15pm

emptynester2009 wrote:
<p>&lt;p&gt;I don't think the pink movement is even debatable, You've attempted to take it to debate twice.  Why? &lt;/p&gt;
</p><p><span style="font-family:comic sans ms,sans-serif; font-size:medium">Although I have never debated it on this forum I think that the pink movement is very debatble.</span></p><p><span style="font-family:comic sans ms,sans-serif; font-size:medium"></span><span style="font-family:comic sans ms,sans-serif; font-size:medium">Many people do not realize how little the are doing for the cause in buying or wearing pick.  Pink things will not help find a cure for cancer, money will.  You get a much better bang for the buck donating $50 than buying a $50 item in which only a few cents are donated.  I recently got a booklet from a cancer organization that I donate to monthly about thier partners who are helping.   A company will not get my purchasing dollar if their donations are completly tied to purchares "For each purchase we will donate $.03"  A company that does a straight donation "We will donate $100,000 regardless of sale" will.  </span></p>[/quote]

Very wise, Emptynester.

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-01-2002
Sun, 10-20-2013 - 12:18pm

rollmops2009 wrote:
Empty, yes exactly, that is one of the key issues in all this. Another is how stage 4 women are shunted aside and overlooked because they don't fit the whole "Rah-rah, get a mammo and all will be fine" narrative. But apparently we are insulting and upsetting Jams by bringing up these issues, so I guess we should refrain.

Again, that is your country, Mop.  Not mine.  Speak for your country, perhaps qualify your words.  But you speak for no one but yourself and the poor, untreated women of Greece. 

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