Marriage equality argument

iVillage Member
Registered: 02-20-2013
Marriage equality argument
213
Tue, 03-26-2013 - 8:21pm

So the sole argument against marriage equality is that marriage is for procreation? Where exactly does that leave menopausal women? Or men with ED? Or the infertile? 

I can not believe we are STILL having this discussion in 2013. I have noticed that it is generational though--many of boomers I know are against it. Gen Xers like myself and younger are generally in favor...

On Wednesdays we wear pink.

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iVillage Member
Registered: 05-31-2011
Mon, 04-01-2013 - 4:24pm

pumpkinangel wrote:
That is what I don't understand.  I know many here are adovatces of a sahp and unless one is independently weatlhy, there is a very real dependence on the working married spouse in the sahp household.

I guess it's only "best" if you manage to have the right kind of spouse. 

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-27-1998
Mon, 04-01-2013 - 4:08pm

BeaArthurisMyReligion wrote:
<p>but leaving it up to the states does exactly zero with regards to the benefits and rights that straight couples have under Federal law that I don't have...but these cases are good steps forward and I do believe a sea change is starting to occurr...and they have certainly shed a light on the sheer legal inequality between gay married couples and straight married couples and started a dialogue that is definitely to the good. Even one of my own coworkers was stunned when I told her I have to file 'single' on my taxes each year.. she assumed since we were married in a state with marriage equality on the books that it meant we were married in the eyes of the Federal government too... every one of these conversations I have had has been so fulfilling... one person at a time, one dialogue at a time.. and change happens...</p>

I agree, it is and should be a national issue.

PumpkinAngel

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-14-2011
Mon, 04-01-2013 - 2:45pm
Thumbs up, Bea. :)
Avatar for BeaArthurisMyReligion
iVillage Member
Registered: 02-20-2013
Mon, 04-01-2013 - 2:41pm

I believe it may be.. I have to do more  research but I know that the center of that case- Edie Windsor - brought suit based on the $389,000 she had to pay in taxes when she inherited her late wifes estate... so that kind of inequality is definitley at the root of it all...

I would just be happy to know that we could move to any state we wanted to and still be married...

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-01-2002
Mon, 04-01-2013 - 2:36pm

lifespeachy wrote:
My hubby WAS an opponet.... he assumed, like many do, that if same sex marriage is legal in one state, that gay couples had all of the same rights as straight married couples. I really do think that a lot of people just don't realize that's not the case.

I don't know if a change to the federal tax code (IRC) is part of DOMA...  But the IRC would have to be changed.  And there's argument that, if all adults can someday have the choice to marry anyway, there should be a change to the Internal Revenue Code and estate taxes addressed.

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-14-2011
Mon, 04-01-2013 - 2:32pm
My hubby WAS an opponet.... he assumed, like many do, that if same sex marriage is legal in one state, that gay couples had all of the same rights as straight married couples. I really do think that a lot of people just don't realize that's not the case.
Avatar for BeaArthurisMyReligion
iVillage Member
Registered: 02-20-2013
Mon, 04-01-2013 - 2:06pm

but leaving it up to the states does exactly zero with regards to the benefits and rights that straight couples have under Federal law that I don't have...but these cases are good steps forward and I do believe a sea change is starting to occurr...and they have certainly shed a light on the sheer legal inequality between gay married couples and straight married couples and started a dialogue that is definitely to the good. Even one of my own coworkers was stunned when I told her I have to file 'single' on my taxes each year.. she assumed since we were married in a state with marriage equality on the books that it meant we were married in the eyes of the Federal government too... every one of these conversations I have had has been so fulfilling... one person at a time, one dialogue at a time.. and change happens...

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-01-2002
Mon, 04-01-2013 - 2:04pm

grapthars_hammer wrote:
<p><blockquote class="quote-msg quote-nest-1 odd"><div class="quote-author"><em class="placeholder">lifespeachy</em> wrote:</div>Article on the front of iV today..... http://www.ivillage.com/supreme-court-considers-gay-marriage-case/6-a-530493</blockquote></p><p>Good article, and this quote:</p><p><em><strong>"The two cases before the Supreme Court this week, however, have renewed a hope that, ironically, reignites all my anger and sadness. Yes, things for my family are fine -- if unequal -- but they are not fine for everyone. And no matter how accepted I feel in my immediate community, my country has made a concerted effort to let me know that I am most definitely NOT accepted. And that is something I'm ashamed to say that I came to accept. Inequality is NOT acceptable."</strong></em></p><p>bears repeating. Often.  And loudly.  By all of us.</p>

Many, many desperate and deserving people rightly want the US Supreme Ct to hear their case and to intervene.  10,000 cases a year, approximately.  Of those, the US Supreme Ct hears very few.  Less than 85; and less than 70 are taken on submission.  Forgetting which government generally has jurisdiction over "marriage", very few cases ever get judicial scrutiny at that level.  The US Supreme Ct doesn't speak for anyone.  In fact (and law), it can't.

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-01-2002
Mon, 04-01-2013 - 1:56pm

reginageorge2005 wrote:
<p>So the sole argument against marriage equality is that marriage is for procreation? Where exactly does that leave menopausal women? Or men with ED? Or the infertile? </p><p>I can not believe we are STILL having this discussion in 2013. I have noticed that it is generational though--many of boomers I know are against it. Gen Xers like myself and younger are generally in favor...</p>

Without reading thru, let me just say my *opinion*  (Then try to read thru this juicy debate.) 

Marriage equality has little to do with procreation.  The US Supreme Ct shouldn't even have these cases for many reasons.  Rather, it's a matter for the states.  Also, the cases now before the US Supreme Ct likely won't uphold Proposition 8, or DOMA because the appellants don't have standing.  It's a procedural matter.  It's probably the wrong time for these petitioners to be heard before the US Supreme Ct.

iVillage Member
Registered: 02-20-2013
Mon, 04-01-2013 - 11:26am

savcal2011 wrote:
<p><blockquote class="quote-msg quote-nest-1 odd"><div class="quote-author"><em class="placeholder">jamblessedthree</em> wrote:</div>Then leave the thread, I'll follow you Katie. Gay rights among other poltiical issues are hugely debatable. You want this to get personal now? Wow! I find calling my church a judgemental one offensive and being called a bigot is offensive. This isn't about you it's about the issue and there will always be two sides of it just like other issues, Stand up for what you believe in but don't convince me of it.</blockquote></p><p>"Then leave the thread, I'll follow you Katie" -- is that a stalking threat?</p><p>"This isn't about you it's about the issue " -- no, it is about her.  She will be directly and signficantly affected by any legislation that comes out of this (or goes away because of this).  If this isn't about her, who the hell is it about?</p><p>"Stand up for what you believe in but don't convince me of it" -- oh, we realize that no one can convince you that you're just plain wrong.   But what YOU believe shouldn't prevent her from enjoying the EXACT SAME RIGHTS that you do.  In actualy, it is those that are oposed to gay marriage that are trying to affect those who are "gay married."  Extension of basic rights to married homosexuals will have NOT A SINGLE EFFECT on you and your daily life.  Her beliefs and life have NO EFFECT ON YOURS.  So why do you want *your* beliefs to have an effect on hers?</p><p> </p><p> </p><p>Why am I even wasting my breath/keystrokes?  SMH.</p><p> </p><p> </p>

Fantastic post, I'm only sorry it is moot!

Shaking my head at the things grown women get their panties in a wad about.

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