Pharmafia (Pharma Shills)

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-06-2009
Pharmafia (Pharma Shills)
46
Mon, 12-28-2009 - 11:10am

As cunchymomto2 (and others) have accused myself (and others) of being paid pharmacy advocates - I thought Dr David Gorski's reprint of this tired ad hominem would be instructive.

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-16-2009
Thu, 01-14-2010 - 11:29pm

Ok so, for measles the main immunity comes from IgG antibodies that cross the placenta before birth. Mothers who have had natural measles seem to pass on higher levels of these antibodies to their babies, providing them with slightly better protection.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9178461


Quote: Neutralizing antibody titers of 47 infants whose mothers sustained measles (measles group) and 70 whose mothers were vaccinated (vaccine group) were compared at birth, 4 and 8 months of age. All children had antibodies at birth and 88% at 4 months. At 8 months, 49% had antibodies in the measles group and 15% in the vaccine group (P < 0.001). The geometric mean titers were significantly lower in the vaccine group than in the measles group and the difference corresponded to the antibody loss occurring in only 1.5 months of life. This small difference may reflect past exposure to wild virus of many vaccinated mothers.


http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6TD4-4811JYB-4&_user=6779283&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&view=c&_acct=C000010000&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=6779283&md5=b4ed33766fc5cb041b443038810a3f9d


Quote: Infant’s antibody concentration decreased with age, but for every month of life geometric mean antibody titres for infants born to vaccinated mothers was significantly lower than GMT for infants born to mothers who experienced measles.

These results indicate that the duration of passive measles immunity is related to the maternal source of immunity and support results of previous studies


Some IgA antibodies in colostrum can also provide some protection against measles but only in the first few weeks. Here it says levels dropped to below protective in breastmilk before 2 weeks http://tropej.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/51/1/45


Quote: Fifty-five colostrum samples from the same mothers and 347 breastmilk samples collected at various periods of breastfeeding also showed that anti-measles IgA had dropped below the protective cut-off within the first 2 weeks of birth.


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iVillage Member
Registered: 04-09-2008
Fri, 01-15-2010 - 8:59am

Can we also agree that the MMR vaccine has effectively eliminated the threat and spread of this illness with a lower mortality and comparatively low risk?


I'm not trying to be difficult here (really, I'm not); I'm going to have to give this a "maybe". Six years prior to the introduction of the measles vaccine, the mortality rate declined by 98%. Trying to get the actual source on Dublin is proving challenging, but may I assume that you at least know the statistics we are referring to?


I will defer, you will need to cite a source for that claim.

Rands

iVillage Member
Registered: 04-09-2008
Fri, 01-15-2010 - 9:57am

Okay, I just copied your post (but didn't include all) so you knew what I was replying to.

Rands

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-06-2009
Fri, 01-15-2010 - 11:39am

Okay - I will grant the acquisition of some immunity from exposed mothers, regardless of source (wild

iVillage Member
Registered: 04-09-2008
Fri, 01-15-2010 - 11:51am

Okay - I will grant the acquisition of some immunity from exposed mothers, regardless of source (wild

Rands

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-06-2009
Fri, 01-15-2010 - 12:09pm

Rands - as info, it looks like the UK is recommending a different approach to >9 mos children and MMR based upon passive immunity.


With regard to the adverse events, we should agree on a scale.

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-16-2009
Fri, 01-15-2010 - 12:12pm
You know what really bothers me about this topic?

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iVillage Member
Registered: 04-09-2008
Fri, 01-15-2010 - 1:55pm

WRT safety - this is the problem (one of) that I have with the whole thing: (quick disclaimer so not to confuse any issue, a vaccine could be 100% safe, and I'd still avoid them like the plague, pending no changes in conditions) - (I'll address your scale at the very bottom, but I believe an introduction to the scale is due)...


Considering we're talking about measles, should an AE occur, to which component was it related to? Measles? Mumps? Rubella? (possibly chicken pox if receiving the MMRV)? The same will also obviously hold true to other combo vacc's.

Rands

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-06-2009
Wed, 01-20-2010 - 10:21am

Rands,


That's a good question.

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-16-2009
Wed, 01-20-2010 - 2:51pm
Do you support the resumption of manufacture of the separate components of the MMR?

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