Pretend Play

iVillage Member
Registered: 08-26-2005
Pretend Play
5
Thu, 01-05-2006 - 9:09pm
Hi,
How or do your kids pretend play? The only pretend play Jake(2.5) would do before now always included he and I at his train table, each with a train using the same scripted lines from Thomas books or movies. Over the last couple of months his pretend play has come on so much, it's amazing. It still revolves around trains but it's now more original with a lot less scripting and he uses his body more in play, he pretends to be all different types of trains while he choo choos around the house.He even played doctor with his cousin over the holidays. No jokes please!(LOL)I think this has happened because he seems to be more aware of where his body is in space and he's not as scared to try new things as he used to. I had another question this time about empathy, Jake tells me not to correct Ella if she's doing something naughty because it makes her feel sad. Is this not showing empathy?He's doing so well in every area I'm wondering if he'll lose his diagnosis someday. I know that sounds bad and that I care too much about a label but I guess what I really mean is, is it possible he could improve so much he wouldn't stand out in a classroom of NT kids his own age? I remember Renee saying one of her kids diagnosed with PDD-NOS was doing so well he may lose his diagnosis or maybe I read wrong, I have a bad habit of doing that. Regardless of whether Jake holds onto the diagnosis or not I am totally sure he'll always have a few quirks, but don't we all!!!!
Teresa
iVillage Member
Registered: 02-20-2001
In reply to: baboig
Thu, 01-05-2006 - 9:20pm
Bobby's pretend play really blossomed last summer right after he turned 3.

 


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iVillage Member
Registered: 10-03-2004
In reply to: baboig
Thu, 01-05-2006 - 10:58pm

Dear Teresa,

You are asking lots of questions, and I totally understand why. Wouldn't this "going off the spectrum" be so nice to be able to predict, but I think that can't really be done. My child is older, and has indeed learned to often blend in with NT children for hours, days, weeks. Until the moment he doesn't. And then he can again. And he continues to learn more and more all the time. I don't know if he will "come off the spectrum" -- I'm not sure I am completely off it myself. I suspect I will stay MUCH more in touch with his development than parents of NT children have to, except when I don't have to.

Every child on or off the spectrum is so completely unique. Many people on the spectrum have actually managed to "blend into" a classroom of NT children, indeed, even grew up in them, even without intervention or therapies, but not all of them really understood social cues, really had true reciprical friendships, etc. A child can seem very "non"-spectrum for periods of time, and then something happens or a situation changes that they can't handle emotionally, or don't understand, and more spectrum-like behavior returns. Also, a spectrum child is very capable of learning the rules of a classroom, having a teacher who is respectful and helpful, children who are kind and friendly. But this classroom can change from year to year, or as the child gets older and grows they sometimes get left behind developmentally and socially. So, a "blended" child can then "unblend" 3 or 4 years later, sometimes disasterously.

My own child is a great case in point. He is 8 with dx of PDD-NOS, although we have been told that his dx is borderline, because of splinter skills and lack of some diagnostic criteria. He is brilliant at imaginary play, often interacting in that play with other children (but this has been encouraged and even taught with him for many years, now he improvises on his own). MANY spectrum children I know, including him, understand emotions and have GREAT empathy. They can still have real difficulty reading social cues, esp. if they are not paying attention because of sensory overload, obsession, rigidity, etc. right in the moment. Your son is observing your daughter when you are reprimanding her and it is not directly involving him. The bigger difficulty could come when HE is making her sad because of his strong desires that could blind him to her emotions or caring about her point of view at that moment in any way. --- Not that all children (yes, and adults) don't struggle with this one when their own desires are not being met.--- I just know that Malcolm can have bigger problems with handling situations like that, where other children would be better able to deal. And then, many times, he has no trouble at all, same set of circumstances.

So there you are. I don't think there is really an answer to what you are asking. I personally think spectrum isn't exactly curable, but the ability to translate NT to ASD and then cope can grow, the ASD individual can learn to communicate and become independent. I think a "cure" is more likely a very borderline dx in the first place. Temple Grandin and Dawn Prince-Hughes, 2 massively published ASD success stories, both write of how much they still need to rely on friends and loved ones to steer them straight when they are making big social gaffes. And they are careful with keeping support and love around them at all times. Not exactly a bad plan, really....

Sara
ilovemalcolm

iVillage Member
Registered: 02-24-2004
In reply to: baboig
Fri, 01-06-2006 - 3:03pm

Teresa,

I think Nathan started pretend play around 5. It took him awhile to start doing this. But he still likes to pretend play by himself, whispering under his breathe. He likes to reinact things he has seen, and also add his own ideas as well.

Nathan also shows concern about others. He doesn't always "look" like he's concerned...but if asked he will tell you. He will also just say it out of the blue if the mood strikes him!! He is ALWAYS concerned about his brother's feelings, mommy, and daddy. He runs to his brothers aid, all the time. Whenever Tyler gets in trouble for something, Nathan always has to say something in his defense. "don't be mean to my brother!" "don't yell at Tyler!" (this is funny because I don't yell!!! He hears a different tone in my voice....and just knows Tyler is in trouble!" It is sweet....but then I have to explain the situation to Nathan, so that he understands what is really going on. Then he's fine.

michelle

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
In reply to: baboig
Fri, 01-06-2006 - 4:33pm

It is so hard to figure out how to respond to this. ON the one hand, theoretically there can be children who are missed diagnosed with ASD who actually only have sensory integration or auditory processing problems and when they get older and gain skills they lose thier ASD diagnosis. I would actually say it is more common for a child to diagnosed with SID, APD or ADHD when actually what they are is autistic and it was missed young. There are also kids with ASD who make so much progress that they "appear" recovered, especially when they continue to recieve appropriate support and understanding but thier brain always works like a person with autism. They can become very high functioning though.

There are also kids (and Cait fell into this category) who make tons of progress and appear "recovered" around the kindie age but as they get older and more is expected then the ASD starts to become more apparent again.

I was ready to get Cait undiagnosed at 6 or so I felt she was doing so great. Sure there were some glitches but overall she had made worlds of progress. Her very very VERY wise pediatrician said that if a child with ADHD on meds is doing well it doesn't mean they aren't ADHD anymore. She wanted to see Cait make it through an entire year with no support services, no medication, nothing and be successful before she would un-diagnose her. We didn't make it 6 months.

As she has gotten older sometimes she does better and sometimes not so much. Really depends on her level of support, stress and comfort. This week she is doing great. Still quirky. Still not great eye-contact, still trouble with 2 way conversations that aren't completely around her obsession, but she actually came to my room looking for me saying "Hey mom, I hadn't seen you in a while. Thought we could do a puzzle together". For her that is huge. She usually doesn't make social outgoing connections like that.

As for the empathy. Be careful with that one. Despite Mike having every other symtpom of autism, that one and being socially outgoing with peers (not appropriately but he was outgoing then) withheld his diagnosis for years. Finally, this still bugged me when he was diagnosed and the neuro explained it well. (she specializes in ASD). Basically, it isn't that people with ASD can't or don't have empathy it is that often they don't realize when someone else is hurting. But in situations where they have learned it then they do. Or if they realize later that someone has been hurt, etc. We had the same exact example. We were going on a field trip when Mike was 3-4 and he said "Mom, don't tell Caiti. She will be sad". Empathy right? Yes but not intuitive, but learned. He had heard a hundred times from me not to tell his sister things that we did when she was in school because it would often lead to a tantrum if she was unable to go. I would be willing to bet that Jake has seen Ella cry after similar situations and has been taught that crying means sad. Or perhaps even heard something similar from you.

Our therapist even says that she has seen often with ASD people will be able to have empathy for a situation that doesn't involve them. Particularly in the case of what is righteous. But they have a hard time seeing how THEIR behavior affects others.

It is a really REALLY great sign that Jake can do that. It shows an ability to learn these skills. This is something Cait still struggles with. Mike does it rarely but he can more so than she does, though his other symptoms of autism are more significant. The fact that Jake can do it at 2 is WONDERFUL but it doesn't mean he isn't on the spectrum.

Unfortunately, I think you are going to have to wait until the middle of elementary school to know for sure on that one. He may do great and be able to be mainstreamed or included with few supports throughout his school career but by then you will have a pretty good idea how he thinks and if he thinks like an autistic.

Even Dave I think he is going to loose his PDD diagnosis but I am going to give him atleast until the end of 1st grade before I decide for sure. I know he is not neurologically typical but he may progress well enough not to need a full diagnosis. There are still just some little quirks. He has a fabulous teacher and so has no other supports right at this time. He has an IEP but I haven't even pushed to have it implemented. Likely it will be dc'ed this year. But who knows how his 1st or 2nd grade teacher will be and that will be the deciding factor. Those are the ages when things really started to fall apart for my other 2.

Renee

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iVillage Member
Registered: 01-19-2005
In reply to: baboig
Fri, 01-06-2006 - 5:51pm

Hi Teresa,

If I remember, Jake and my Eric are about the same age? Eric is 3.5. His pretend play really started taking off, similar to Jake's in the last 6 mos. He too is a Thomas fanatic and has also started making things up, not just following video story lines and using his body. It's great to see. In our case, though, I know some of it is from our Floortime and he takes something I did, then builds on it. Eric also "played doctor" for the first time with his cousin over Christmas and I was thrilled too.

The empathy question is one I am also struggling with. A year ago, Eric obviously didn't have empathy. We started working on how to id emotions and he easily got to the point of being able to "read" other people's emotions, but it was like Renee said. Sad people cry. Happy people smile. He learned the rules. What he feels is hard to say. Then one day I was crying bc we were having to put our old sweet dog to sleep. Eric came up and said, "don't be sad Momma. I will whistle gaily like Thomas to make you happy. Wooo Wooo." Of course I was delighted, but still not sure what had happened. He knew I was sad, seemed to want to make me happy, but used an old "script" from Thomas to do it, still, it did make me smile.

Then over Christmas, his cousin was crying and Eric came over to her and said, "don't be sad. I still like you." Then went into the same "whistle gaily..." from Thomas. I guess he felt it worked once it could work again. (It did!)

I read Donna Williams talking about empathy (do you know her? She's an artist with ASD who has written about her experiences). She said she can't always tell how the other person feels when she is "in the moment" but often after the fact when she thinks about it she can. She said that only once was she really "with" another person feeling empathy in real time and that is was such a moving intense experience which took a lot out of her that she felt a bit jealous that it is so easy for us NT people. That really made me think about our kids and how I need to be more patient. Empathy is one of my strengths, I wear my heart on my sleeve, so I admit a lack of it is hard for me to understand, though I am learning.

The "losing the diagnosis" part is hard. You read about people whose children lost their diagnosis or were "cured", but I don't know any in person, although I know many who have improved amazingly and blended to the point that they may not need services. In fact, we had a problem where Eric scored too well on testing and lost his early intervention services briefly because of it. Then he regressed big time and it's taken work to get on track. I have also seen the, "gets worse then comes out better" situation play out when Eric is working on a new school. He gets more "autistic" but when he finally gets the new skill he's like a new person.

Eric is so young, so I have only seen a couple cycles of the "doing great and seems almost NT, I love this kid!" only to be followed by the frustrated stimmy little guy that I love in a different way--wanting to protect and keep at home with me forever. I can see what all the ladies with older kids have said as being true, that there are good times and bad times and our job, I guess, is to teach them how to cope when they are faced with the bad times. I guess that is any parent's job.

But I don't want to take away your joy at Jake's great progress. He is doing terrific and you should feel so good about it. Our kids are so special and when we are finally able to connect with them, though pretend play or music, or watching them play with another child it is so gratifying. We know better than anyone how much WORK it takes to PLAY!

Eric's quirks are part of his charm and I don't want to "flatten" out his personality at all. I guess I just want to expand his world a bit.

Katherine