Question

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
Question
3
Tue, 07-15-2003 - 10:46am
Any AS kids who are "social". My 3.5y son got dx with mixed developmental disorder. We are to be re-eval in 1 y for ASD again. I asked about AS and they said he's too young to know for sure. And right now he's very social, wants to make friends, wants to play with others, good eye contact, uses gestures, etc. He just can't "play" non-aggressively. Then of course--no one wants to play with him. Is being "anti-social" a "critieria" in most kids who have AS? The speech-path thought he was on the spectrum--but the rest of the "team" didn't think so.

Holly

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-11-2003
In reply to: hollym4k
Tue, 07-15-2003 - 5:47pm
Well, Holly, that's a subject that is greatly debated in the psychol community. There are those who think the child or person must be significantly withdrawn to be on the spectrum. And then there are those of us who look at the dx criteria with a literal eye and compare these 'outgoing Aspies' to 'normal Aspies' and see that they are the same, simply with different personalities types.

One of the reasons so many of my contemperaries have been drawn to discourse is because there are actually 3 different ASD dx critical lists in circulation, each seperate and slightly different. One of them does say that the person in question must be withdrawn, however, this is NOT the one used in the DSM-IV. Infact the list used in the U.S. and Canada seems to specifically NOT say 'withdrawn'. Instead it says 'social impairment'. Hand any Aspie a dictionary and ask them to to investigate if these sayings have the same meaning. You'll get an emphatic "NO, they do not mean the same thing!"

So, why do so many 'proffesionals' misunderstand? Well, I don't think I should post that here, it would take up too much space on your thread and make us all stray from your topic. But I will post it on the Resource Page. We are planning on publishing the page no later than Monday the 21st, barring no major e-catostrophies. When it's up look for my article on 'PC Society'.

I for one think that a child can be outgoing and still be on the spectrum. I think this because I have a few. Jade is boarderline between AS and HFA and she is incredably 'outgoing'. She has no emotional problems walking up to any givin kid and introducing herself. The problems arise when she tries to play with them. She has a very hard time with 'other peoples imaginations' and can't understand why she should 'play thier game', especially when she has a game of her own she wants them to play. She doesn't quite 'get it' when other kids are pretending; she often takes them litterally. She also assumes that they are playing when they are being serious. Her body language and vocal tones are attrocious(sp?). She has a real tendancey to grate on people's nerves if they aren't used to her. Hse's also had problems with personal space and inapropriate touching.

Eva (ASD-PFS) is also outgoing. But she is totaly clueless that not everyone will want to do things 'her way'. To the un-enlightened eye she seems incredably aloof, selfish, and self centered. And while, yes, to a certain degree she is (but only to what is normal for a child her age-3.5) she is very concerned about the feelings of others. People who don't know her don't understand when she suddenly becomes upset and runs away after she accedently hurts someone's feelings or makes them angry. She tries so hard to be a well mannered little lady, but she often does the exact wrong thing, and because of that, well....you get the picture. She's the queen of 'doing the right thing at the wrong time'.

The social skills of both of these kids fit the discription of 'social impairment'. They also fit into the criteria of 'failure to develope peer relationships appropriate to developmental level'. Why? Because the word 'develope' means "...to mature, to grow, to maintain growth...", it does NOT mean ".....to initiate, to start, to begin...." Again, ask any Aspie to pick out which sentance is correct:

A) She developed her drawing in the morning, then worked on it again later.

B) She started her drawing in the morning, then worked on it again later.

And the phraze "started to develope" (a term any post pubescent female is familliar with) would not be correct English if the two words meant the same thing.

Okay, I did it anyway, I strayed from the topic. Holly, please forgive me. I haven't had my first pot of chocolate yet today, LOL. But, to answer your question....In both my persoanl and proffesional oppinion, yes, a Spectrum Child CAN be outgoing.

Peace,

Candes


iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
In reply to: hollym4k
Wed, 07-16-2003 - 2:42am
Well Candes beat me to it. I just wanted to add the thing that kept us from getting Mike diagnosed for so long was that he is outgoing. He made friends easily at the park. He will go up and get any kid playing but still doesn't understand social cues.

A good example came from one report that the neurologist noted. When he was 3 he was at preschool being observed. He and some other children were playing some chase game. The other kids tired of it and went to play something else. Mike kept playing the game. They kept walking away and he just wasn't getting it. THen he started trying to play this scheme with some girls doing a monster thing and they screamed and cried for him to stop, which he didn't. This went on for quite some time. Mike would get stuck in some play scheme and the other kids would want to stop and he wouldn't get it. Then he would scream or pitch a fit if they didn't play by his rules.

When Mike was younger it wasn't that noticable. Little kids are pretty forgiving and boys can be rambunctious. However, now as he gets older, his lack of social understanding is getting more obvious. THe kids are more savy and will tease Mike for his little oddities and he doesn't even know that they are. The other kids are starting to think he is odd and he is having more difficulties. I am concerned about him having more problems and becoming less outgoing and less freinds as he gets older. We have started working on it with a psychologist and social skills group.

Dx or not, if you can start on the social skills now, It would definitely be worth it.

Renee

Photobucket
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
In reply to: hollym4k
Sat, 07-19-2003 - 1:56pm
Thanks Renee--any everyone!!

My son is like that--but I always think that it's just him being a pest. On the 4th of July--he was really good, not hitting anyone!! But after everyone got into a water fight--adults included, he didn't stop after it was over. The water balloons were gone and everyone put away the water bottles. My son was so overstim'd that he went on the deck and started hitting everyone with a broom. After that got taken away--he got the dustpan and threw it off the deck. He wouldn't stop!! We had to leave.

I think he just gets overstim'd really easily--so maybe it's not really a "social" issue after all.

Holly