Well, Mike's got "it" too

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Registered: 03-26-2003
Well, Mike's got "it" too
6
Mon, 05-05-2003 - 10:39pm
Or as the neuro said, he is on the "asperger's spectrum". She was trying to nicely say asperger's. She knew it wasn't a total shock and I am taking it in stride. i did have some questions, becuase I didn't think he was totally AS. First, he can be empathetic and very sensitive. She was telling me that a number of Aspie's can be very sensitive when they realize they have hurt someone. Problem is they don't usually realize when they do. They do not usually understand social cues. That is true of Mike and she was able to point it out in some of his evaluations I had brought along. They were older and hadn't read them in a while, but the observations were still appropriate. I still can't quite reckon AS with the fact that Mike is outgoing and meets everykid in the playground easily. Of course he insists they play his way, but for the most part gets along with kids well.

Well I need to get off line. Cait tried out for a play tonight and I need wait for the call to see if she made it. I couldn't believe she actually got up there and auditioned. She usually freezes with any new things, but she had no fear what so ever. Not even the usual kid butterflies or jitters. Maybe she has found erh nitch. She has been begging me forever to let her be in a play.

Renee

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Registered: 03-26-2003
Tue, 05-06-2003 - 7:21pm
Well, at least you know what your dealing with now. I know it can seem strange that one Aspie is one way and another is different (sometimes radically so), but that's how it normally happens. None of the Aspies in my family are exactly alike. They are different people, so why should thier autism be the same? In some ways they all share similarities and in others they are opposites. When your used to seeing something like AS as part of one person's personallity it can take some adjusting to see it in another person. Heck, I often forget that Ayla is on the spectrum because I'm used to fixing all of Jade's problems so much. Ayla is very independant while Jade is almost totally dependant on me. And with Eva I was hard pressed to see ASD in her because she is so flexible with speech, where DH, Jade, and Ayla are not. I had to sit down and say "Wow, Eva is more like dgm. She can come up with orriginal sentences, LOL" DH, Jade, and Ayla most often rely on their vast memories for quotes and phrazes.

Jade is outgoing and meets others easily too. But she gets lost with most conversasions so she kinda just 'goes with the flow' and acts like she understands. Sometimes it's obvious this is happening and sometimes it's not. Dgm is like that too. She does a lot of silent nodding, lol.

As far as being sensitive, why not? Saying that an Aspie can't be sensitive is like saying they don't have feelings. My DH is very sensitive. He doesn't attend Angel's peri-sugical proceedures anymore because they are done in the open casting room. He can brace himself against the sound of Angel's crying when they are changing her casts, but he can't handle it when another kid starts screaming in terror of the saw. Last time he went he had to leave the building and sit in the car so no one would see him crying. He also had to stop and throw up on the way to the car because he was so upset by the little girl's tears. And this is a 39 yo Aspie with well honed survival skills. He doesn't go to the hospital with us anymore, lol. Poor thing.

Well, it's an interesting road learning about the different ways autism can manifest. There will never be a dull moment. maybe a few moments where you consider running away to Italy, but never dull.

Peace Sweety,

Candes

Peace,
Candes  
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Registered: 03-26-2003
Tue, 05-06-2003 - 11:42pm
Your are right about the sensitive thing and that is true. DH is really not very accepting of the AS diagnosis. He just says he sees traits but not the full thing. DOesn't help that he works in the field and questions this particular neurologist on other kids diagnosis. He thinks she has been full of it on other occasions. But honestly DH is not very flexible in his thinking as well. He has one picture of asperger's in his head and that is pretty much it. He is getting better though. He thinks our neuro over diagnosis. I won out on keeping her because honestly even if she over diagnoses, she is the best in the field locally. His one comment when I started talking AS was "you seem to forget that central to asperger's is social withdrawal". I don't think he said withdrawal per se, but it was similar. Mike makes friends easily and DH can't rectify that with Asperger's. Mike does end up screaming at friends frequently for breaking one of his rules.

What leads me to think asperger's is his age. Since he was tiny he has had some quirks that were similar to PDD but we always said he just didn't fit. As he gets older more and more of the quirks become more pronounced. He has lots of difficult behaviors but I could see him easily being misdiagnosed. I myself go between AS, OCD and NLD. Bipolar has been mentioned as well as the original ADHD. ASD stuff has been mentioned by doctors since he was little and we kept saying "but he doesn't quite fit". I think that in a typical situation he would be one of those AS people diagnosed older and that more and more symptoms will stand out as more becomes expected socially. I think we knew where to look because of our background and family history. I think if things continue as is he will be socially withdrawn as his behaviors become more and more unacceptable.

Quite honestly I don't care which label they stick on it I just want to finally address the core problem. Obviously ADHD wasn't right and I am tired of chasing ADHD meds. So what if some think he doesn't meet the exact criteria for AS. Fact is the core of the way his brain works is like that of a person with AS and to help him we need to treat it as such.

BTW, mike does come up with spontaneous language, but I can't tell you how often or for how long he will say phrases for a situation that are from a movie or TV show. Been doing it since he was little. Still will say things frequntly during the day and you can just tell it isa line from something he is using at that moment.


Thanks for your support. Honestly, I rather AS to many other difficulties. I think they are just such a neat, amazing group of people. Mike amazes me daily, when he isn't driving me crazy.

Renee

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Registered: 03-27-2003
Wed, 05-07-2003 - 12:15am
Renee, I totally agree with your last line that AS kids are so different & unique in their own way. I see alot of Mike's behavior in Sarah & can relate. It's good that you got a diagnosis & can move on from here! Keep In touch-Mary Ann
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Wed, 05-07-2003 - 7:23am
LOL, at the risk of showing my autistic gene-set, I beg to differ with your DH. I too work in the field, and as far as I know the the central issue is not social withdrawal. The current concensus (at least in this area) is that it it social ineptness. While the majority of Aspies DO withdraw socially, for quite a few it comes only after being harassed and belittled by other kids because they are different. And still others are totally oblivious too negative reactions and teasing.

Jade constantly wants to call up the kid down the street to come over and play even though he has told her in no uncertain terms (and quite loudly) that he doesn't like her and doesn't want to play with her. It's heart breaking to watch that. She just doesn't get it, even though I've explained it to her.

My dh was like that when I first met him too, and he was an adult. People generally like him, and even gravitate towards him at first. But after time, when people get to know him, they see and feel that he is 'different' and treat him badly. He has been working at the social skills he missed learning as a child and is getting better. It may seem unbelievable to us, but he was actually 34 yo before he realized that when a person says they think you're stupid they usually mean it. And he was 36 before he realized that when people don't return your calls that means they don't want to talk to you. He is constantly confused why people can't just be honest and straight forward.

Ayla, on the other hand, is the model 'withdrawer'. If we have someone over she usually slinks like a cat in the shadows. It darn near takes a prybar to get her to go outside, and she is happier being sequestered to her room with a mountain of books than bieng forced to talk to another living soul.

Hope I didn't offend.

Peace,

Candes

Peace,
Candes  
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Registered: 03-26-2003
Wed, 05-07-2003 - 10:54pm
Candes, I love the way you put things. I am so not offended. If anything, I think that DH being rigid is a bit apple not falling to far from the tree. although he is not Aspie per se, he has his own traits he would never admit too. He is the quiet, shy type. Never understood why he doesn't have lots of friends, etc. Though he wouldn't hit the full criteria, he sure has some problems with social cues himself. Heck, I am sure I have traits too. I know I do, but I think I cover it better.

Personally, I do think Mike has AS. I think more traits will come out as he gets older and more is expected of him. Autism and asperger's has been mentioned for years by doctors and even school personnel, but when they get to know him better they think maybe not. Probably because me and DH have been so insistent for so long that he isn't. You see he is so different from Cait and I consider Cait mild. Mike's "autistic" traits were milder, so he couldn't be. Now I think they are about the same but different.

Off topic, What do you know about bipolar? I value your oppinion on lots of this stuff so I hope you don't mind me asking. Dave is a confusion to me. He is going through a very difficult phase again. He has done this consistently since he was tiny. I took him to the neuro and we are testing for Landau Kleffner. Only problem is he is going through one of his regressions again, but there is no loss of skills or language, just a behavioral regression. The scariest thing is the tantrums he is throwing and the things he is getting into. he also has all but stopped eating and wakes frequently at night. I find him naked under beds. I have a friends whos son is bipolar and the similarities are scary. I am starting to think it may be BP, but the thought that this disability and AS would hit one family seems weird.

Thanks,

Renee

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Thu, 05-08-2003 - 11:38pm


I know it may seem wierd that two disorders would hit the same imediate family, but it's realy not. Especially in families where Autism and/or Turettes are seen. While some disorders can be traced to a single gene, such as ADHD, Autism can be traced to several. The current popular train of thought in the research community is that Autism and Turettes are both the result of multiple genetic mutations. It's like baking a cake, you have cerrtain ingredients you work with that are always used. However, just like you can change the flavor, texture and color of the cake by using 'a little more of this or a little less of that" or "adding an extra ingredient", so too can the mutative recipie of autism be changed. PBD, OCD, ADD/HD, and several more, are believed to be 'ingedients' in the gene-set (recipie) of autism. While some are very subtle in one person they may be more severe in another. Some of the mutaions can also 'counteract' the affects of others.

Now, what do you think would happen if you make a cake and you don't add the leavening, sugar, eggs, water, ect, and only put flour in the bowl? Well, you would have a bowl full of flour. You could call it a cake all day long and it would still just be a bowl of flour. The Autistic gene-set is the same way. If you don't have all of the mutaions you don't have autism, just BPD or OCD or whatever it is you end up with for flour. Since the mutaions are seperate it is possible to pass along only one or two instead of a full set, especialy if the other parent has very strong genes in those areas. This is where natural selection comes into things. Weak genes can be 'overpowered' by stronger genes when the double helix is formed. We are all familiar with 'domonant genes' such as eye color, but we are only now beginning to unravle the mysteries of psyciatric pathology. There are still a lot of questions out there on how all of this happens inthe way that it does. I hope that we will get some answers before I turn old and die of boredom, LOL. Otherwise I might have to live forever just to find out how it all ends. Okay, I never said I wasn't nuts. LOL.

I hope I have answered your question and not confused you further.

Peace,

Candes

Peace,
Candes